FORKNI-L
Digest - 5 Mar 2008 to 6 Mar 2008 (#2008-62)
Thu, 6 Mar 2008
There are 11 messages totalling 594 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Favourite Immortals Redux (4)
2. FK Redux - Or, here we go again. (3)
3. Last Saturday's Birthday: March 1
4. Yesterday's Birthday: March 5
5. Enforcers, Carouche, and the Nature of Blood (2)
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Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 17:10:19 -0500
From: Ramona Jackson <lexyladyjax@g.......>
Subject: Re: Favourite Immortals Redux
> LaCroix is a memorable character....but the show is Forever
> Knight...not The Cross That I Carry.
>
> Tim
ROTF! That's a great way to condense Nunkie's role.
Mona
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 17:04:42 -0700
From: Walt <wdoherty5@c.......>
Subject: Re: Favourite Immortals Redux
Shouldn't that be "LaCroix that I Carry"?
By the way, it may be of interest to note that "crux"
in Latin (and we all know the old reprobate is/was
a Roman general) means "torture".
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ramona Jackson" <lexyladyjax@g.......>
To: <FORKNI-L@l.......>
Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2008 3:10 PM
Subject: Re: Favourite Immortals Redux
>> LaCroix is a memorable character....but the show is Forever
>> Knight...not The Cross That I Carry.
>>
>> Tim
>
>
> ROTF! That's a great way to condense Nunkie's role.
>
> Mona
>
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 18:03:22 -0700
From: Walt <wdoherty5@c.......>
Subject: FK Redux - Or, here we go again.
We've had these questions previously:
What do you think happened to the characters in Last Knight.
On that basis, where are these characters today?
Here's a new question:
If the XYZ Network announced that it was picking up Forever Knight
and a new season would start in August - 13 shows being ordered initially --
where would the show pick up from? What sort of scenario do you see for the
show?
I think there would be only one prerequisite: the show is Forever Knight,
so the Knight must be featured, but I would think just about anything else
would be up for grabs. Even the "Forever" part as long as you could make a
case for it.
There are any number of scenarios, the most common:
one would be just to ignore that the past 12 years have happened and
pick up right after Last Knight. If Nick had appeared in Natalie's morgue six years ago, instead of
1990, it would have been 2002). This would necessitate an entirely new cast.
Another would be to just start up the show 12 years later, presumably
in another city, Nick having moved on, and with production costs being what
they are, how about Vancouver? Although personally, I'd go for Seattle 'cause
the Space Needle could stand in the the CN Tower.) This also would probably
require an entirely new cast, too.
What would your take on the show be?
I like this one: Nick Becomes Captain
After Last Night, Nick has regained his mortality, and for the past ten
years has been the captain at the 96 th, Now he's being promoted and will move
downtown (or someplace).
GWD guest stars as Nick. Then we get a new young vampire whom Nick mentors.
Nick still despairs 'cause the new vampire doesn't have the conscience Nick
has and wants to suck all the criminals he catches dry. Catherine Disher could
be a guest star, too.
Walt Doherty
Phoenix, AZ
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 20:18:55 -0600
From: eowyn23@j.......
Subject: Last Saturday's Birthday: March 1
Hi Y'all!
My apologies for getting this out so late. I've been working 10-13 hour
days for the last week. There have only been 3 things on my mind when
I've gotten home. Feed the crew, fix myself something to eat and SLEEP.
Last Saturday was National Pig Day and Peanut Butter Lover's Day and the
Birthday of:
Tricia (mere de Vachon) meredevachon@g.......
You may send birthday greetings to Tricia at the above email address.
Please NOT to the list!
Others who share Tricia's birthday:
Dirk Benedict, TV/Movie Actor
Robert Conrad, Actor
Ron Howard, TV/Movie Actor
Frederic Francois Chopin, Composer
Dinah Shore, Pop Singer
Significant events on this day:
1, B.C., Start of revised Julian calendar in Rome.
1952, A moral code is adopted by the television industry.
1961, Barbie gets a boyfriend. Mattel introduces the Ken doll.
1962, The 1st K-Mart store opened by variety store operator S.S. KRESGE
in Garden City, MI.
I hope you had a very Happy Birthday, Tricia!
If you would like to be added to the birthday announcements, please send
your name, birthdate (no year needed) and email address to me,
eowyn23@j......., privately, and I'll be glad to add you.
Terri
eowyn23@j.......
GWDFC, FK X-Stitcher, Proud Survivor of FK Fic Wars 8-12, Texas Knight
Dreamers, Knighties List Owner, Keeper of the FK Birthday List
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 20:29:42 -0600
From: eowyn23@j.......
Subject: Yesterday's Birthday: March 5
Hi Y'all!
Yesterday was Holy Experiment Day and the Birthday of: Lynn L. Sowinski
lls761@s.......
You may send birthday greetings to Lynn at the above email address.
Please NOT to the list!
Others who share Lynn's birthday:
Patricia Heaton, Actress
Mary Wilson, Rhythm and Blues Singer
Charles H. Goren, Columnist
Harry Helmsley, Businessperson; built the Empire State Building
Charles Jr. Walgreen, Businessperson
Significant events on this day:
1634, Samuel Cole opened the first tavern in Boston, Massachusetts.
1789, the Constitution of the United States went into effect as the first
Federal Congress (9 senators, 13 reps) met in New York.
1902, The American Automobile Association (A.A.A.) was founded in
Chicago.
1989, Time Incorporated and Warner Communications Incorporated announced
plans to merge into the world's largest media and entertainment
conglomerate.
I hope you had a very Happy Birthday, Lynn!
If you would like to be added to the birthday announcements, please send
your name, birthdate (no year needed) and email address to me,
eowyn23@j......., privately, and I'll be glad to add you.
Terri
eowyn23@j.......
GWDFC, FK X-Stitcher, Proud Survivor of FK Fic Wars 8-12, Texas Knight
Dreamers, Knighties List Owner, Keeper of the FK Birthday List
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 08:01:05 -0500
From: "Phillips, Tim" <Tim.Phillips@s.......>
Subject: Re: Favourite Immortals Redux
>> LaCroix is a memorable character....but the show is Forever
>> Knight...not The Cross That I Carry.
>Shouldn't that be "LaCroix that I Carry"?
Consider it from LaCroix's view point for the last few hundred years.
He gave Nicholas eternal life, wealth and the power over all mortals.
In return, he lately been receiving heart-ache and insolence and a
constant chorus of "you are evil!" from his ungrateful child.
Nicholas is the cross that LaCroix must carry to his death....
Tim
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 08:19:18 -0500
From: "Phillips, Tim" <Tim.Phillips@s.......>
Subject: Re: FK Redux - Or, here we go again.
> If the XYZ Network announced that it was picking up Forever Knight
> where would the show pick up from? What sort of scenario do you see for
> the show?
Here's my revision of an idea I had years ago (adding a couple of ideas
from Walt or sparked by Walt).
Captain Nicholas Knight is now head of the 96th. He is a mortal and as
aged naturally since the events of Last Night...when he "reverted". He
is married to Natalie and they are both living on the "fringes" of
vampire society.
LaCroix is still about and as "senior" vampire in Toronoto maintains
contacts with Nick and Natalie to deal with "rogue" vampires and the
need to conceal activities that could get them noticed.
Ideally, these three characters are all played by the original actors
(Nigel seems to have been blessed with an ageless face to my eyes... he
could pick right up as LaCroix without anyone batting an eye, Ger and
Catherine would play perfectly as they currently are as a couple of
dedicated public servants mostly trying to live a normal life).
These three characters are - however - effectively supporting cast and
gues-stars. You won't necessarily see them in every episode. But,
they provide different sides of mentoring to a fairly new vampire that
suddenly is in Toronto.
For variety, I would cast a woman in the lead role as the title vampire
of Endless Nights.
You would then be able to "ping-pong" the lead character between Nick
and LaCroix whenever you wanted to play with questions of mortality.
I would personally home-base the story in Toronoto as I still think it
is used by productions for its good economics and it is simply the right
city to put it in....but you could move around (to achieve some of the
variety of the flash-backs from FK ) by having the title character
entangled with something like MI6 or a Canadian secret service...
Tim
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 08:29:48 -0800
From: Sherri <bloodroses_thorn@y.......>
Subject: Enforcers, Carouche, and the Nature of Blood
My GF and I recently had a rather lengthy discussion
regarding our oldest, most favourite cheesy vampire
show. And by discussion, of course, I mean two hours
of arguing. ^_~ But, several good points were
brought up, so I figured I'd throw those out and see
what all of my fellow fans think. Let me explain.
No, there is too much. Let me sum up..
First was the nature of blood as it relates to Forever
Knight vampires. We know from "Francesca" that
vampires get more than simple nourishment from the
blood they drink. They get the memories and the
emotions and the talents of the person they feed on...
at least for a short period of time. This of course
explains so much when you realise that the darling
Brick has been feeding on predominantly cattle for the
last 100 years or so ^_~. But this raises the
question: Why? Why do they get this psychic feedback
from their food source? What sort of evolutionary
purpose did it serve? And if the emotional aspect of
the blood is actually important to the vampire, is
Nicolas missing out on something because he's denying
himself that?
My GF compared it to living off of cheese doodles...
you won't starve to death, but you'll definitely be
malnourised. On the other hand, I think the psychic
feedback is more of a .... flavouring to the blood.
Something to make it more palatable, but not actually
necessary. Like filet mignon versus hamburger meat.
Because we know that vampires can thrive on animal
blood. Screed may be many things, but sickly ain't
one of them. Well... not until Fever, at least.
*sniffle*
Which brought up the topic of the carouche. Are the
carouche a different breed of vampire? Are their
physical make-ups different, to allow them to live off
the blood of animals? If you go by book canon, it's
established in "These Our Revels" that Vachon brought
Screed across which would make me believe that
carouche and regular vampires are the same type of
vampire... they just have different preferences on
what to eat, based on what they fed on first (in
Screed's case, rats on his ship). The carouche are
sort of vampire vegetarians, I guess. Nicolas and
LaCroix do look down on the carouche as being almost
lesser creatures, but Nicolas and LaCroix are both
extremely snooty and classist, and my feeling is that
the majority of vampires who first feed on animals are
probably from the lower classes of human society,
since the upper class would have had more... appealing
fair at hand. Of course, in "Blind Faith" we see
LaCroix treating the carouche that brought Raleigh
across like some sort of beast... but for all we know,
it actually /was/ some sort of beast. Raleigh can't
have been the first vampire dog. (I love that my canon
has vampire dogs!)
We see Screed back down from Nicolas on several
occasions, but is this because he's just
non-confrontational, or is Nicolas just that much more
powerful than Screed that he wouldn't risk a fight he
couldn't win? And if he is more powerful than Screed,
is it because he's a stronger type of vampire (despite
feeding on cattle) or is it just because he's so very
much older than Screed?
And what do you think the carouche actually are? A
normal vampire, with abnormal feeding preferences?
Another species of blood-sucker altogether? Or some
sort of bizarre mutation of the normal vampire?
And finally, while discussing bizarre mutations, the
topic of the Enforcers came up. Just what exactly are
the Enforcers? I've always figured they were just the
police of the vampire community. LaCroix backs down
from them not because they're any more powerful than
he is, but for the same reason most normal folk
respect police officers. The guy with the badge isn't
usually any stronger or faster than the average joe...
but he's all that stands between you and uncontrolled
chaos. LC's obviously not a big believer in following
the law, but that doesn't mean he doesn't recognise
and respect that the laws are important for the rest
of the population to follow.
In Unreality TV, they do seem to act differently from
normal vampires, though. The oh-so-menacing but
extremely easy to escape pace they walk at, their lack
of conversational abilities, the fact that LaCroix
backs down from them... the list of abnormal behaviour
goes on. But is that because they're actually some
other type of vampire, some sort of super-strong but
not so smart class? The jocks of Vampire High, maybe?
Or are they actually just normal vampires, they just
act like hardasses? I've kind of always assumed it
was just an act. After all, if the whole point of
your existence is to wander around the world routinely
executing vampires who break the law... are you really
going to go out of your way to be friendly to someone
you may have to kill later?
I know most of these questions have come for
discussion before... but I never get tired of talking
about FK, so I figured I'd shove them out there one
more time. So, tell me gentle listeners, what's your
opinion on these topics? I look forward to hearing
it.
-Noni
-Torture is not what you do *to* someone, but what you have them do *for* you.
-If you belong to nobody, you are nobody.
-Abuse is more than power, it is intimacy.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 13:13:11 -0700
From: Walt <wdoherty5@c.......>
Subject: Re: Favourite Immortals Redux
>>> LaCroix is a memorable character....but the show is Forever
>>> Knight...not The Cross That I Carry.
> He gave Nicholas eternal life, wealth and the power over all mortals.
> In return, he lately been receiving heart-ache and insolence and a
> constant chorus of "you are evil!" from his ungrateful child.
>> Nicholas is the cross that LaCroix must carry to his death....
>
This would make LaCroix a Jewish mother:
The angst, the worry, the ungrateful child,
and on top of all that, he gets a shiksa for a
girlfriend. ;->
> Tim
>
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 13:18:22 -0700
From: Walt <wdoherty5@c.......>
Subject: Re: FK Redux - Or, here we go again.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phillips, Tim" <Tim.Phillips@s.......>
To: <FORKNI-L@l.......>
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2008 6:19 AM
Subject: Re: FK Redux - Or, here we go again.
>> If the XYZ Network announced that it was picking up Forever Knight =
>> where would the show pick up from? What sort of scenario do you see
>> for the show?
>
From Tim:
> Captain Nicholas Knight is now head of the 96th. He is a mortal and as
> aged naturally since the events of Last Night...when he "reverted". He
> is married to Natalie and they are both living on the "fringes" of
> vampire society.
>
Very nice. This really sounds workable, too.
You could probably really get Disher, Bennett
and GWD to do guest shots.
Another advantage is you could use shots from
original shows for flashbacks.
> (Nigel seems to have been blessed with an ageless face to my eyes... he
> could pick right up as LaCroix without anyone batting an eye,
You're right about that. If you look carefullly, you can see
the changes that ages bring, but you *have* to look carefully.
He is also so good in whatever he does. He deserves
the Canadian oscar for whatever he happens to be in.
Walt Doherty
Phoenix, AZ
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 13:35:22 -0700
From: Walt <wdoherty5@c.......>
Subject: Re: Enforcers, Carouche, and the Nature of Blood
>
> LaCroix treating the carouche that brought Raleigh
> across like some sort of beast... but for all we know,
> it actually /was/ some sort of beast.
That, howeverr, is the way that LaCroix
treated everybody!
>
> We see Screed back down from Nicolas on several
> occasions, but is this because he's just
> non-confrontational, or is Nicolas just that much more
> powerful than Screed that he wouldn't risk a fight he
It would seem that part of a vampires power
lies in his age: the older he is the stronger he is.
> And what do you think the carouche actually are? A
> normal vampire, with abnormal feeding preferences?
This would get my vote.
> LC's obviously not a big believer in following
> the law, but that doesn't mean he doesn't recognise
> and respect that the laws are important for the rest
> of the population to follow.
>
Actually, I think LaCroix is a big believer in the law;
basically *his* law though. Plus, there may be an
element of fear and/or coercion, it is not so much that
people (or crooks) are afraid of an individual police
officer (or enforcer), but more of the power of the
whole justice/judicial system that's behind them.
I don't think LaCroix would hesitate to take out
an enforcer if he thought he could get away with
it, but I'm sure he knows that if two of them
disappeared while going to see him, that others
would be following to find out what happened.
> In Unreality TV, they do seem to act differently from
> normal vampires, though. The oh-so-menacing but
> extremely easy to escape pace they walk at, their lack
> of conversational abilities,
It would also appear that they are chosen
for their muscle and not their mental prowess.
Or, then again, maybe they're just cranky. ;->
Walt Doherty
Phoenix, AZ
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End of FORKNI-L Digest - 5 Mar 2008 to 6 Mar 2008 (#2008-62)
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