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FKSPOILR

Logfile LOG9606 Part 9

June 8-June 9, 1996

File: "FKSPOILR LOG9606" Part 9

	TOPICS:
	Spoilers/all/What I learned from the Last Four Eps  (3)
	Farewell to the List
	Bye Bye FKSPOILR
	The Final Weekend
	So Long and Thanks for All the Talk :)
	SPOILER:  Last Knight  (2)
	FKSPOILR: 5 Months on List
	SPOILER:  Last Knigh
	Last spoiler list post
	SPOILER: Last Knight
	It's been nice  (4)
	New waves:  "Ashes to Ashes"
	The end of FKSPOILR (long)

=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 8 Jun 1996 23:19:52 +6
From:         Don Fasig <phase3@g.......>
Subject:      Re: Spoilers/all/What I learned from the Last Four Eps

On  8 Jun 96 at 19:54, Gehirn Karies wrote:
> LaCroix is him sitting in his dark apartment in his new leather chair,
> sipping a drink,  holding an open copy of Romeo and Juliet, page marked
> by the Divia cameo, staring off past Nicks painting of the sunrise on his
> wall into the abyss of the night sky, consumed by his pain, grief and

I like it.

But that wall with the window.  On one side you have the sunrise, on the
other the portrait of Janette.

Now where to put the Roman bust...?

Don Fasig     ---,-<@
phase3@g.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 8 Jun 1996 21:55:40 -0000
From:         Nancy Taylor <taylorln@o.......>
Subject:      Farewell to the List

Well, a farewell party is just the thing to drag me out of lurkerdom.  I
have really enjoyed this list and all the fine people who post to it.
Although I've only posted once before, I have avidly followed all the
discussions and have benefited from the diversity of opinions.  I
couldn't begin to tell you how many times I've had my original opinion
of an episode reversed a full 180 degrees, or at least modified
somewhat, due to the lively debates between all of you.  So many times
I've had to go back and rewatch an episode (oh, such exquisite torture)
to catch a line or a look that I missed the first time around, but that
you all caught.

I will miss you all and hope to see you all over on ForKni-L.  To you,
Mr. Bennett, thank you so much for lurking with us and for giving us
such wonderful performances in such a wonderful show.  Hope you will
come and lurk with us on ForKni-L now that Spoiler is going away.  :)

So, farewell, FKSPOILR!  It's been a fun ride!

Nancy <TaylorLN@o.......  -or-  NancyT503@a.......>
Knightie, See-Through Knightie (hi, Dotti!), with Nick&Natpacker leanings
Occasionally backsliding into Dark Knightiehood and Light Cousindom
with thoughts occasionally straying toward the Unnamed Faction (hi, Tippi! :) )
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 00:31:28 +6
From:         Don Fasig <phase3@g.......>
Subject:      Bye Bye FKSPOILR

Shortly after discovering FORKNI-L I was pointed to FKSPOILR - what a
revelation.  I was a Forever Knight fan before that, but the discussions on
this list helped raise my appreciation to new levels.

It was this list I always read first, and that led me to begin taking
notes as I watched each new episode.  It opened my eyes to many
possibilities and interpretations I would otherwise never have seen.

Thanks all.  I hope to see you on the other lists...and one day on a
resurrected spoiler list.

Don Fasig     ---,-<@
phase3@g.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 8 Jun 1996 22:40:39 -0700
From:         Dianne Therese De Sha <maeve@g.......>
Subject:      Re: The Final Weekend

oops!  almost missed my big off-topic chance!

Um...

Uh...

<Drat! Where are all those off-topic thoughts when you really need 'em?>

Karen writes:
> In this last weekend of FKSPOILR, I'd like to send thanks to the
> people who've worked very hard to make the lists available to all of
> us: Our Esteemed Listowner, Red, Our Wonderful Assistant
> Listowners, (past and present): Laurie, Lisa and Jamie, Our
> Hardworking Subscription God, Don, and Our Courageous List Baby-sitter,
> Allie.  You're all amazing!

May I second this?

(Well I just did anyway... so there! :-p)

It's been fun, it's been grand... and I'll see you all on the
other two lists anyway :-)

Dianne

*OBLastWeekendOff-Topic: Went to the Renaissance Faire today-- had
fun, won a feather for my hair at darts, hit a bull's-eye in archery...
got lobster-fried on the shoulders... :-p

Dianne la Mercenaire...   -*-   <cat.goddess@p.......>
-*-"We must be powerful, beautiful, and without regret."-*-
[SOS-FK: http://members.aol.com/CuznJamiMR/SaveForeverKnight.html]
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 01:44:35 -0400
From:         Ray Heuer <RayHeuer@a.......>
Subject:      Re: So Long and Thanks for All the Talk :)

     I post this as a reply mostly because I liked the title and wish I'd
thought of it first.

     First, to Mr. Nigel Bennet, thank you for your marvelous work on FK,
both as actor and director.  You deserved your Gemini this year, and I think
you deserve two more next year.  I hope that you will lurk on FORKNI-L and
continue to share your insightful comments with us.  You have an established
audience for virtually *anything* you and the other actors move on to on that
list as well.  I *dare* the listowners to no-post Uncle for non-FK posts.

     Second, to the people and hamsters at PSUVM, thanks for giving us a
home, and for not yelling *too* loudly when we choked the listserv.  Thanks
also to Jaye and Laurie and Jamie and all the other Asst. Listowners that
were, but we're not through with you yet (or is that the other way around?).

     Thirdly, to all the intelligent, witty, insightful posters on this list,
thanks for "forcing" me to go back and re-watch many episodes when I thought
I had them completely analyzed the first time.  Any excuse to watch FK, even
those awful early 3rd season eps, is greatly appreciated.

     Finally, remember that this is a graduation, not a funeral.  FKSPOILR
may be gone, but FORKNI-L is still here, and we can still pick nits over
episodes until doomsday.  And if you want to analyze something new and fresh,
subscribe to FKFIC-L and we can discuss some of the excellent fiction  coming
out over there.

     Just as an afterthought - to all of the FK creative types that might be
secretly lurking, thanks for giving us such a great show to talk about!

  --  Ray
   Nat Vamp Camp

     Rage!  Rage!  Against the dying of the Knight!
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 06:01:16 GMT
From:         Jamie Melody Randell <immajer@n.......>
Subject:      Re: SPOILER:  Last Knight

Since this is most likely my last post to the spoiler list, I'd like to
take the opportunity to send my thanks and love to the many listmembers
I've talked with, agreed with, argued with, set nomail, and all that other
stuff.  There have been times I've wanted to get you all into a group hug;
there have been times when I have wanted to hunt down each and every one of
you and slap you upside the head; but in any case, FKSPOILR has always been
*interesting*.  And I look forward to seeing you all here again, once we
have NEW fk episodes to discuss.

Now.  To business.

On Jun 08, 1996, Sharon Himmanen, Sandra Gray and Nigel Bennett wrote:
(Don't ask me to keep track of who wrote what.  It's 1:30 am here.)

>Nat could see no light at the end of the tunnel and, in effect, commits
>suicide.
>
>IMO, there is a world of difference between saying "Nick, drain me," and
>saying "Nick, make love to me.  Take just a little at a time,"
>
>Nick has saved Nat's life more than once in the past and I think she felt she
>could depend on him to protect her... Neither of them were really
*thinking* clearly.
>
>What is sad, to me, is that Natalie is portrayed as a fool in the
>last episode, unwisely placing her trust and faith in the one person
>she should *never* have had faith and trust in.

(Jaye suspended all the FKSPOILR list rules except for "Be Nice".  I can do
this!  Nyaaaaah.)

I don't think there is any lack of clarity over what Nat wanted from Nick.
I think that, after however-many-years of this not-quite-relationship, what
Nat wanted most was some sort of progression: how long can a relationship
of any sort remain unchanging, without growing into something deeper, or
ending altogether?  The death of her friend, I think, brought home to Nat
just how fleeting life is... when you're mortal, anyway... and that if she
wanted more in her own existence, she was going to have to go out and get
it.

I think she believed in Nick, trusted him, more than she should have -- not
because Nick is inherently 'bad', or weak; not because of any influence LC
might have over him; but because it is pointless and futile and hopeless to
believe in someone who does not believe in himself.  Nick did not believe
that he could love Nat without killing her; therefore, he was incapable of
doing so.  If he *had* had more faith in himself, in the strength and
'goodness' in him... things might have been different.  And if Nat had not
been at such a fragile point, after the death of her friend, she might have
recognized the error in her basic assumption.  I strongly doubt that in all
the years, this is the *first* time she would have had thoughts in that
direction.  Merely the first time she's acted upon them.

But to say that it was an intentional act of suicide... hel-lo?  Nononono.
It was an intentional act of SEX.  Nothing more.  (Or would-be sex.
Bite-chomp-slurp does not count.)

>There's no way to know if he really did take *too much* or was just
>so appalled that he couldn't stop that he wasn't paying as much attention
>
>He kills yet another woman out of uncontrollable lust and hunger.

Ummm... hel-looo?  This would be the same Nick who SPENT THE DAY in the
same apt. with Janette in HF and couldn't tell that she was mortal, right?
Are we really going to trust this boy with a life-or-death judgement of any
kind?  (You can, if you want.  I'm not gonna, tho'.)

>You see, the way it felt for me at the end was that Nick had
>beaten Lacroix, and had finally regained his humanity.  So, for
>me, LK is a victorious ending and a deeply positive one.

>>I did not find the ending victorious or deeply positive in any way.

>Maybe I won't always feel this way, but LK just effectively made all
>of Nick's questing to be something better a *waste*.  And that's wrong.

I will find it interesting to see, as the new FK fans trickle in from SciFi
airings, how *they* perceive LK, and the series as a whole.  Unlike us,
they will be viewing all three seasons as a whole -- and they will no doubt
find wonderful points of continuity that tie all three seasons together --
and they will have a totally different perspective of the series; while the
rest of us sit here and go, "Hunh???"  Their POV of Last Knight will
undoubtedly be quite different than ours... but I expect to see quite a few
more rewrites of that last episode, as FKfic writers far and wide rack
their brains for a way to 'make it better'.

I personally feel that Last Knight, while very well-acted, was incredibly
depressing, and negated the very premise that the show was ostensibly based
upon -- the faith in something greater, something higher, something better.
 However -- to some degree, I feel that the ending was... realistic.  That
an ending such as that is perhaps the only one that the characters might
have found, had this been Real Life.

But it was not Real Life.  It was television... and it was much-loved
television... and the characters, AND THE VIEWERS, deserved something
happier than that.

>
>And by the way, I do not have the script for "Last Knight." <g>

It is Yet Another Thing Which We Do Not Have. <vbeg>

But there is one Thing Which We DO Have... the LK "blooper" script... and I
strongly suggest that everyone donate their money to charity and get
themselves a copy.  If for no other reason than to ponder the nuances of
the character of Paramedic #1. <g>

In closing, let me reiterate my viewpoint on Life, The Universe, and
Everything Forever Knight:

NOBODY DIES.  NOBODY EVER DIES.

'Nuff said.

(The Webgoddess has left the building.  Thank you very much.)


--
Jamie M.R. <immajer@n.......> aka Paramedic #1, Natpack Touring
Company
 Asst. Listowner, The Smoking Natpacker, ConvCoS, NDNEDnik
-->>> Illustrated Webgoddess & Keeper of Warm Fuzzies <<<--
** List Rules <http://cac.psu.edu/~jap8/FK/FKRules.html> **
The Truth Is Out There. Just maybe not in our jurisdiction.
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 02:27:22 -0500
From:         Sandra Gray <TMP_HARKINS@d.......>
Subject:      Re: SPOILER:  Last Knight

Jamie writes about new FK fans who come from SFC airings:
>Their POV of Last Knight will undoubtedly be quite different than
>ours...

That depends on where they happen to come in.  Those who just *started*
watching the show have seen the *ending* pretty early on, when they
perhaps haven't gotten much of a sensation of the characters.  Some
of those people might have decided that having seen what appears to be
the final episode that they're not interested in seeing how the series
got there.

Those that catch the *repeat* of the ending (which I suspect will air
late this summer or in the fall) will have formed an opinion based on
maybe half of third season.  Now there are some really good third
season episodes, but how many of them will air before then?  And how
much attachment to the characters and the story will people have by
then?  Again, I think those that missed the initial showing of the
last episode that see it at this time may again run a risk of not
having gotten overly interested in the show and stop watching.

But I think that those people who *start* with first season and
eventually make it through to the end will have similar reactions to
those of us who've been watching since first season--hurt or hatred
or denial that Nick and Nat are dead.

I can't help but think that those who see the ending before the first
two seasons will see the earlier seasons in a different light because
of it, as some people have on these lists and the newsgroups already.
But it will be interesting to read the reactions.

--Sandra Gray, forever Knightie
--tmp_harkins@d.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 8 Jun 1996 23:47:39 -0700
From:         Amy R. <akr@n.......>
Subject:      FKSPOILR: 5 Months on List

Has it only been five months?  And has it been five months already?

I discovered the lists in the aftermath of HF, which had so distressed me
that I, incompetent with computers as I still am, actually searched you
all out.  I had to discuss FK with someone, and I was blessed beyond all
asking in the "someone" I found.

You all care so much -- *see* so much -- and express it so well.

Apache's eloquence, Lisa McD's knowledge, Cynthia's certainty, [Name removed by request]'s
humor, Sandra's devotion, Lisa Prince's philosophy, Gehirn's sarcasm,
Dotti's enthusiasm, Laurie's authority, Tippi's wickedness....

Carrie and Idalia and Margie and Kat and Valerie and TJ and Marcia and
Jane and Bonnie and Paula and Leslie and Stephanie and Catherine and all
the people named after Apollo's sister, through the myriad of spellings
and initials....

Listowners, Assistant Listowners, List Babysitters, hamsters....

Everyone who posted regularly while I was here, and those who only
surfaced occasionally.  And Nigel.

Thank you all.

Thank you for arguing me to a standstill when I was wrong, agreeing with
me when I was right, and tolerating me when equally valid interpretations
clashed.  Thank you for inspiring me to insights I could never have found
on my own.  Thanks for sharing the tears (too many) and the laughter (not
yet enough).  Thanks for making fkspoilr the most challenging and
delightful place in cyberspace.

*And I will see you all on forkni-l!*

*** Amy, Lady of the Knight  (akr@n.......) ***
         "And Nick.... Nick wins."  -- NB

Bright and Shiny Knightie, Light Cousin, Fleur-Booster,
Ex-Nevermore, (Im)Mortal Beloved, Ravenette of the New Order,
Serial Natpacker, Fuzzy N&Npacker, Unwilling Urchin, Pax FK, SKLite,
Devotee of Marcia's "Rosy Limbo Between the Second and Third Seasons"

(Look! I'm violating the sig-length rule!  Lucky Jaye suspended it....)
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 09:38:02 +0200
From:         Marina Bailey <tmar@o.......>
Subject:      Re: SPOILER:  Last Knigh

In response to Nigel Bennett's comments, Sharon A. Himmanen
<romana@i.......> wrote:
 Ro> IMO, there is a world of difference between saying "Nick, drain me,"
 Ro> (which is what some people claim she did) and saying "Nick, make love
 Ro> to me.  Take just a little at a time," (which is what she *really*
 Ro> said).

I've watched this episode twice only so far, but I didn't see it in such a
clear-cut way. Natalie didn't ask Nick to drain her, true. She *did*,
however, give him permission to *bite* her, and the implication of that (and
what they both said) was that if he did end up draining her, he would either
bring her across or join her in death. "No matter what happens, we'll be
together." "Forever." I can really empathise with Natalie here; I probably
would have taken the same chance... Well, maybe not. :) I would have gone to
find someone who knew what they were doing and asked to be brought across...
like Uncle. :)

 Ro> I didn't see it so much as beating LaCroix as much as simply just
 Ro> giving in, which in my book makes Nick the biggest loser in "Last
 Ro> Knight."  He doesn't regain his humanity as much as he regains some
 Ro> equanimity with LaCroix [snip]

This might be right, although I think that by refusing to go off with
LaCroix and by joining Natalie in death, Nick was turning his back on what
being a vampire represented. So poor LaCroix ended up losing his son. Shame.
You know, the more FK I watch, the sorrier I feel for Uncle, having to put
up with his wayward son all the time. Of course, this is a debate better
held over on Forkni-L. I've always been a Knightie (albeit a Dark Knightie),
but I've come to like Uncle more and more.

 Ro> For me, it was a
 Ro> tragic and unnecessarily negative and depressing end to one man's very
 Ro> positive quest to understand and perhaps better himself with the help
 Ro> of a lot of people who believed in him.

I don't see it as all that tragic myself (tragic would have been Nick
becoming human - he's a vampire, darn it all - Dark Knightie tendencies
coming out there, oops :). I do think he won, in one small way: he escaped
his vampirism. Nick finally had an excuse to escape what he was: Natalie's
death. I'm not saying I necessarily see it that way (I'm still trying to
figure out for myself exactly how I *do* see it), but it is one way you can
look at it.

- Marina.

\\ "You've heard it said that living well is   ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  //
//  the best revenge? Au contraire - living    || R I C H I E >>  \\
\\  forever is the best revenge." - LaCroix    ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  //
//=====Marina Bailey=======tmar@f.......=====||                 \\
\\====Chief Flag Waver and Defender of Richie====Dark Knightie====//

... Picard was only in prison once; Kirk didn't think he saw five lights.
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 09:38:02 +0200
From:         Marina Bailey <tmar@o.......>
Subject:      Last spoiler list post

I'm sitting here trying to think of something 'appropriate' to say... my
mind's blank. Perhaps just that I've enjoyed being on this list with
everyone, but that we're all hopefully going to go right over to Forkni-L so
we won't necessarily miss each other. Bet we'll miss Nigel Bennett, though!
(Unless he decides to come with us... :)

Well, so long. To quote Schanke, "It's been strange." :)=

- Marina.

\\ "to be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing ||Chief Flag //
//its best night and day to make you like everybody else||Waver and  \\
\\ means to fight the hardest battle any human being can||Defender of//
//    fight and never stop fighting." - e.e. cummings   ||  Richie   \\
\\======Marina Bailey=======tmar@f.......=======Dark Knightie======//

... Jack the Ripper excused himself on these grounds: it's human nature.
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 01:11:22 -0700
From:         Sherri <sherric@e.......>
Subject:      Re: Spoilers/all/What I learned from the Last Four Eps

On Sat, 8 Jun 1996, Don Fasig <phase3@g.......> wrote:
>On  8 Jun 96 at 19:54, Gehirn Karies wrote:
>> LaCroix is him sitting in his dark apartment in his new leather chair,
>> sipping a drink,  holding an open copy of Romeo and Juliet, page marked
>> by the Divia cameo, staring off past Nicks painting of the sunrise on his
>> wall into the abyss of the night sky, consumed by his pain, grief and
>
>I like it.
>
>But that wall with the window.  On one side you have the sunrise, on the
>other the portrait of Janette.
>
>Now where to put the Roman bust...?

On a flower stand to the side of the portrait of Janette! :)

Thanks to everyone for the neat things I've learned about FK off of the
spoiler list... I hope we get it back sometime in the future.

Sherri        sherric@e.......   Founding Member, SFKS
Save FK: http://members.aol.com/CuznJamiMR/SaveForeverKnight.html
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 04:29:17 -0400
From:         Gehirn Karies <SoulDebris@a.......>
Subject:      Re: SPOILER: Last Knight

There's a last time for everything ... I'm agreeing with Sandra on
FK spoiler. <snide g>

Sandra said about Sci Fi:
> Some of those people might have decided that having seen what appears to be
>the final episode that they're not interested in seeing how the series
>got there.

I think this is a valid point, somebody brought it up a while ago, but
now that we have seen the last ep, and the feelings it evokes in viewers,
maybe the letter writters should try to talk Sci Fi into canning the last ep
until after all three seasons have been shown.  Otherwise many new fans
from summer channel surfing may be turned off of the series.

I'm not one to miss even a re-run of FK since 1994, the roomie lets me
know when even *he* has seen an ep more than twice, and since LK I
have not caught a broadcast ep.  New viewers will be just as likely to
chill to the series after LK.

Jamie slurred:
>Don't ask me to keep track of who wrote what.  It's 1:30 am here.)

And now it is 4:00 same time zone, less warm and fuzzie dimension.
OB off Topic, and I just spent three hours watching Casino.
Puuuleeeze, just back your car over me a few times, I'll get as much
enjoyment from that.  What a fashion nightmare!  Like, it should be filed
under History, Las Vegas, Mafia in the library.  Dinero does Putz well,
though.  Wouldn't want to be caught ranking Bob.  But when we went to
KMart on the South Shore to buy the BBQ grill Rosy, Penny and Perri
advertised during FK on Sci FI, we got this huge mother of a box of
Microwave popcorn that would last even FanFiction Nick and Nat a
month, and I brought it with me. (I don't have one of those things.)  So,
I, uh, had popcorn at least....  Where the heck was I?

<< However -- to some degree, I feel that the ending was... realistic.  That
an ending such as that is perhaps the only one that the characters might
have found, had this been Real Life.

<<But it was not Real Life.  It was television... and it was much-loved
television... and the characters, AND THE VIEWERS, deserved something
happier than that.

Touche!  FK is our escapism, and they messed with it all bloody season,
then they turned the screw....  Or something like that.
Okay, I'm done in.  Hey! Stop cheering.

Gehirn Karies
SoulDebris@a.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 04:29:29 -0400
From:         Gehirn Karies <SoulDebris@a.......>
Subject:      Re: Spoilers/all/What I learned from the Last Four Eps

Don wrote:

>But that wall with the window.  On one side you have the sunrise, on the
>other the portrait of Janette.
>
>Now where to put the Roman bust...?

I am very sorry that the bleak picture I have in my head did not
originally include the painting of Janette.  LIKE I NEED MORE
BLOODY REASONS TOO FEEL BAD FOR LaCroix!!!!!
Sheeesh

As for the bust, got a hammer?  We could let Sandra do the honors.
And we could offer the severed lips up to auction.

And, Don, I want to thank you for being a cool List Janitor, you
were always very helpful when I screwed up my mailer.  Especially
on, what was it, April 14th, eh, when I could sense it was not a good
time to have been away and bounced to Nomail on the lists.  Little did
I know....

Gehirn Karies
SoulDebris@a.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 06:02:04 -0500
From:         Dolores Sailors <DOLORESES@d.......>
Subject:      It's been nice

As someone who mostly lurked (though I did post a short message a few months
ago) I would just like to say I enjoyed the time I spent on this list. The
discussions were interesting and far-ranging, and I liked the varying
perspectives of the participants. It has been an interesting trip.  :)


Dolores Sailors         DOLORESES@d.......
                             TEXASD@a.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 06:14:36 +0000
From:         "Laura W. Petix" <lpetix@d.......>
Subject:      New waves:  "Ashes to Ashes"

My second collection of waves from "Ashes to Ashes," is now online,
plus a beautiful wave of the Forever Knight theme (in zipped form),
which I recorded from "Last Knight." I know that some other people's
waves of the opening theme are out there, but none of them that I've
ever heard are very clear, and I've received requests for this, so
here it is.  It's quite long, so be forewarned that the download will
take several minutes even though it's zipped (waves don't compress
that much).  The other ones include a wonderfully wicked Divia
quote, Tracy's lovely farewell words to Vachon, and various other
vital "Ashes to Ashes" stuff.

I've no idea what I'll put up next; I haven't had time to make any
new waves recently, and the site may be dormant for a while during
the summer while I am spending time with my marvellous nieces and
when I am visiting Luxembourg on a "Dracula: the Series" pilgrimage.
Be assured that this isn't because I've lost interest in FK (in fact,
my faith in the show was restored by "Last Knight") and the site is
not going away just because FK is not being produced any longer. I
just need a rest for a while. My next collection will probably be a
spectacular group of Nightcrawler waves, but I want to do it right.

Here's what's included in this collection:

Forever Knight opening theme. (460KB, zipped).

Divia to Lucius: We are free to do as we please... to kill as often as
we desire, to bathe in mortal flesh and blood... to do everything that
is forbidden. No one can stop us! Everything we lust after can be
ours... including love. (221KB).

LaCroix to Divia: If I didn't know better, I'd almost say that you had
grown, my dear. (39.5KB).

LaCroix to Divia: When we were mortal, I loved you more than the
Gods... But now... how could anyone love anything as grotesque as you?
(82.0KB).

Reese: Come on Nick, the truth is out there!
Nick: Yeah, but maybe just not in our jurisdiction. (44.3KB).

Tracy to Vachon: I never got to tell ya how I felt about ya... Maybe
you knew. I hope you did. You changed me. You opened my eyes... and
I'll always... I'll always love you for that. (261KB).

-Laura.
lpetix@d.......
http://www.dpcc.com/dpcc/assoc/lpetix/waves/
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 05:36:21 -0700
From:         Kira Chistiakoff <kira@a.......>
Subject:      Re: It's been nice

I just wanted to thank everyone for keeping up the chatter...I've mostly
lurked since I got on list back in Feb or March...and everyone has been so
expressive, even when disagreeing...I'm so glad I got to be a part of all
of this, and I would like to thank the listowners, moomies,
babysitters...and anyone and everyone else...(if I missed anyone important,
chalk it up to exhaustion...it's 5:30 in the morning, and I haven't been to
bed yet:))

Thank you for giving us a home to discuss our favorite show...here's hoping
we'll need this home again soon...


Kira- who's working her butt off to get everything done -<kira@a.......>
Merc, still taking bets on Vaqueras vs. Vachon on SKL
"It's a mystery, wrapped in a riddle, inside an enigma."-JFK
K-Nigget, Member of the CSS, still taking SKL bets on the WAR
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Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 07:25:44 PST
From:         June Russell <Kat@g.......>
Subject:      Re: It's been nice

I'll miss youall. Maybe we'll see those of you who are only on FKSPOILR back
on FK-L!

Kat

Kat ( June Russell )
pacifier.com!grendal!kat    kat@g.......
Heu! Tintinnuntius meus Sonat!
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Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 08:37:39 -0700
From:         Amy R. <akr@n.......>
Subject:      Re: It's been nice

(Silliness on the Spoiler List Alert!)

On Sun, 9 Jun 1996, Kira Chistiakoff wrote:
> of this, and I would like to thank the listowners, moomies,

Moomies!  Moomies!  Ok -- who's been to Finland?  I'm all for Tove
Jansson's Moomintrolls being FK fans, especially Snufkin, but as I know
Kira meant to refer to Jamie, I'm having a much nicer time wondering what
kind of Small and Furry Creature she'd be, living in Moomin Valley!
Maybe a Snork Maiden?  Or a Mymble?  :-)

Recast!
        Moomintroll as Nick
        The Snork Maiden as Janette
        Snufkin as Vachon
        The Hemulan as Reese
        Little My as Natalie
        Sniff as Tracy
        Moominpappa as Schanke
        The Groke as LaCroix

*** Amy, Lady of the Knight  (akr@n.......) ***
         "And Nick.... Nick wins."  -- NB
** Knightie *** Light Cousin *** Fleur-Booster **
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Date:         Sun, 9 Jun 1996 11:10:28 -0500
From:         Margie Hammet <treeleaf@i.......>
Subject:      Re: The end of FKSPOILR (long)

At 08:08 PM 6/7/96 EDT, Nigel M. Bennett wrote:

>You see, the way it felt for me at the end was that Nick had beaten
>Lacroix, and had finally regained his humanity. That is why Lacroix would be
>able to kill him, because he could see that he had finally and utterly lost his
>son, and could do nothing about it. When Nick says to Lacroix "You are my
>closest friend", when he turns to LC in love and compassion and, essentially,
>forgives him, he is human. "Damn you Nicholas" is Lacroix's admission of
>defeat....

Thank you to everyone for being on this list for the wonderful
discussions we have had and the ideas everyone has shared. Thanks to Jaye
for this list and to Jamie for calming unsettled nerves, and to Allison
for the wonderful job of list babysitter.  Special thanks also to Allison
for writing to Jim Parriott after LK.  Allison's post on that helped me
immeasurably.  Thank you to Nigel for being here with us and special thanks
for creating a character I grew to love.  I hope you come with us to the
FORKNI-L list.

But...
I don't agree with that interpretation of LaCroix' behavior at the end of Last
Knight.  Maybe it doesn't make sense to argue with the person who portrays
the character (or maybe it does?), but if I understand that interpretation
correctly, it is of a LaCroix that is far more evil than I see him.  I think
LaCroix is evil for drinking human blood and for encouraging Nick to do
the same, but I don't think LaCroix is evil when it comes to his feelings
for Nick.  What moved me so much about LaCroix is that in spite of the
selfishness and possessiveness that characterized so much of his relationship
with Nick, there was still a large part of his love for Nick that went
far beyond mere possessiveness.  I don't think LaCroix would have been upset
by Nick's forgiveness (which was already apparent in Ashes to Ashes).  If
Nick really did become human, LaCroix would have been terribly sad, possibly
angry, but I don't believe he would have killed Nick.

Whatever the "truth" is, in my FK universe, LaCroix didn't kill Nick.  He
might have staked him, just to bring home to Nick the reality of the
possibility of death and then pulled the stake out.  Hopefully, Nick would
have asked him to pull the stake out, but if not, LaCroix would have done it
on his own.  In fact, in my FK universe, that's what did happen.  When
LaCroix said,  "This, and everything else that's happened here tonight....,"
the word,
"This", referred to the stake, now lying on the floor, having been pulled
from Nick by LaCroix.

To me, Last Knight wasn't the end of the story, just the end of the third
season, made understandable by where the characters were at that point in
their lives and the events of LK itself, leading up to the point where Nick
bites Nat.  Natalie is not dead.  Nick was wrong about how close to death
she was; she will revive.  All three of them will learn from the near
tragedy.  That was the meaning of the sun climbing out of the clouds at the
end.


Margie (treeleaf@i.......)
N&NPacker
Cousin of the Knight
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