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FORKNI-L Digest - 28 Aug 2004 (#2004-237)

Sat, 28 Aug 2004

There are 14 messages totalling 414 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. bringing Richard across
  2. What kind of motorcycle did Nick have? (2)
  3. Close Call 2
  4. Crossing Over (7)
  5. Favorite & Least Favorite Eps
  6. Question concerning Nick's location in May 1980
  7. Crossing Over/Terms

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Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 13:11:52 -0500
From:    "Stone, Barbara" <STONEB@g.......>
Subject: bringing Richard across

Someone said recently that it was uncharacteristic of Nick not to stand up to
Natalie and help her see that Richard should not be brought across.

At one time I would have agreed with this, mainly because I wanted always to see
Nick in the very best light.  But I've come to think that Nick's sense of guilt
is so strong that it can easily cause him to violate his principles.  Natalie,
out of love for her brother, shamelessly plays on Nick's sense of guilt to
convince him to bring Richard across.  She tells him he owes her this one favor
(because she keeps his secret and is looking for a way to make him mortal).  In
Ashes to Ashes, Nick very nearly brings Tracy across because he feels guilty for
her death.  He never told her he was a vampire, so she didn't know that he needed
backup like a fish needs a bicycle.  Natalie has to remind him that he does not
know if vampirism is something she would want.  It is perhaps a major triumph
for Nick (in Last Knight) to refrain from bringing Natalie across in spite of
the guilt he must feel at having caused her death.  This moral triumph is marred
only by the fact that he always did have trouble envisioning the angelic Natalie
as a vampire.  But then, nothing in FK was ever black & white.  Nick was never
allowed to do anything for purely good motives or purely bad motives.  (Games
Vampires Play, Dance By the Light of the Moon).

B. Stone
stoneb@g.......

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 11:12:43 -0700
From:    Knight Ranger <knightranger1228@y.......>
Subject: Re: What kind of motorcycle did Nick have?

Nick did not have a Norton.  The logo is all wrong for
that.  I believe it was a Triumph and I'm checking
some books to find the actual model.

Knight Ranger
______________

< Positively a Triumph.>

< I have always heard it was a Norton Commando, tho
lately on another board someone made a good case for
it being a Norton Atlas.>



=====
e-mail:  KnightRanger1228@y.......  - or -  KnightRanger4ver@y.......
Geraint Wyn Davies Fan for Life!  (GWDFC/GWDN)
Dark Knightie/Nick & Nat Packer/Caddy Whack/FOREVER KNIGHT Die Hard
BLACK HARBOUR Lobster Yacht Lot/Harbour Light  ** -- GAIRWOLFpack -- **
GerII/Bridging/Indecency/Swindon98/NNP98/GerIV/Tucson99/Wolfville99/Wolfville01/GerVI/NNP02/Stratford02(MFL/DNGG)/Wolfville03/Paradise04/Lear04/Cyrano04



------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 11:20:56 -0700
From:    Knight Ranger <knightranger1228@y.......>
Subject: Re: Close Call 2

One of them was, "The Denied" by Emily Weiss.
Throwback to "Stranger than Fiction.  So, at least one
was made up.

Knight Ranger

--- Emily Lacey <laceyem@b.......> wrote:

> Thinking of Close Call, does anyone get a list of
the books stacked on Schanke's desk that he is looking
through? I'm pretty sure that they are made up...

=====
e-mail:  KnightRanger1228@y.......  - or -  KnightRanger4ver@y.......
Geraint Wyn Davies Fan for Life!  (GWDFC/GWDN)
Dark Knightie/Nick & Nat Packer/Caddy Whack/FOREVER KNIGHT Die Hard
BLACK HARBOUR Lobster Yacht Lot/Harbour Light  ** -- GAIRWOLFpack -- **
GerII/Bridging/Indecency/Swindon98/NNP98/GerIV/Tucson99/Wolfville99/Wolfville01/GerVI/NNP02/Stratford02(MFL/DNGG)/Wolfville03/Paradise04/Lear04/Cyrano04


------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 14:28:50 EDT
From:    Sierra Mayberry <Bluefaeryknight@a.......>
Subject: Re: Crossing Over

I read all the posts and here is my new theory: If the vampire doesn't
completely drain them, they cross over.  But, if the vampire gives them their
blood, they share a bond (link, connection, etc) and are family.  This makes sense
to me because it explains why LaCroix is closer with some of his children than
others.


~Sierra

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 20:36:42 +0200
From:    CousinLucilla <cousinlucilla@f.......>
Subject: Re: Crossing Over

This sounds absolutely reasonable but then a thought struck me:
Doesn't Janette say of the hunter, Liam O'Neal (sp?), that he was "nearly
one of us, a half-drained mortal who didn't taste enough vampire blood to
come fully across"? Which would actually add a point to the theory that some
exchange of blood has to occur. But as was already mentioned, consistency is
NOT FK's strong point.

Doris


> Sierra Mayberry wrote:
 my new theory: If the vampire doesn't completely drain them, they cross
over.  But, if the vampire
> gives them their blood, they share a bond (link, connection, etc) and are
family.

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 14:35:54 -0400
From:    Deborah Hymon <debh@e.......>
Subject: Re: Crossing Over

Sierra, I love this theory. Makes more sense than some of the
inconsistencies we see in the FK,TV scripts or fan fiction. Hmmm, maybe a
story in this one.

Deborah
DeborahAHymon.com


my new theory: If the vampire doesn't completely drain them, they cross
over.  But, if the vampire gives them their blood, they share a bond (link,
connection, etc) and are family.  it explains why LaCroix is closer with
some of his children than

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 14:45:20 -0400
From:    Deborah Hymon <debh@e.......>
Subject: Re: Crossing Over

Doris, it could mean a matter of quantity of blood taken. Liam was perhaps
bit, but not nearly drained. Perhaps the victim has to be drained to the
point of barely a heartbeat, and then returns after making their choice
toward the light. But I do like this theory better than any so far. I think
we sometimes get too wrapped up in analyzing the episodes and vampirism.
There will never be a clean definition of how the FK vampire is made, due to
the many writers and lack of consistency.  Oh, but love the discussions of
the many possiblities!

Deb
DeborahAHymon.com

This sounds absolutely reasonable but then a thought struck me: Doesn't
Janette say of the hunter, Liam O'Neal (sp?), that he was "nearly one of us,
a half-drained mortal who didn't taste enough vampire blood to
come fully across"? ~~Doris

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 12:30:42 -0700
From:    Emily <emilymhanson@y.......>
Subject: Favorite & Least Favorite Eps

*Decloaking*

My favorite episodes include Only the Lonely, the Fix, Be My Valentine,
and Close Call.

Hands down, my least favorite episode is Last Knight.

=====
Emily M. Hanson
emilymhanson@y.......
http://www.starbase-eprime.us

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 13:07:59 -0700
From:    Kristen Fife <fenix23fyre@y.......>
Subject: Re: What kind of motorcycle did Nick have?

Thanks for all the responses...it's for a story I'm
writing :)
--- Knight Ranger <knightranger1228@y.......> wrote:

> Nick did not have a Norton.  The logo is all wrong
> for
> that.  I believe it was a Triumph and I'm checking
> some books to find the actual model.
>
> Knight Ranger
> ______________
>
> < Positively a Triumph.>
>
>

=====
http://www.fkvoyage.com/fkfanfic/fife_kristen/
"When a half-breed vampire becomes the object of Mafia revenge, the ensuing
power struggle pits immortal and mortal families against one another." -THICKER
THAN WATER
"The strength of the vampire is that people will not believe in him."

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 29 Aug 2004 08:14:26 +1200
From:    Lilly Chevalier <lillychevalier@y.......>
Subject: Re: Crossing Over

The sharing of blood when crossing over could also
help with increasing the strength and control of the
fledgling.  This could help explain why in the Dark
Knight flashbacks Nick is able to wait before taking
his first victim and doesn't just pounce on her right
away - hey, the blood of a vampire over 1000 years old
has got to have some advantages.

Krista..
Unrepentant Nunkaholic
"Smile, people will think you're up to something."


<But, if the
> vampire gives them their blood,
> they share a bond (link, connection, etc) and are
> family.>


------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 13:15:26 -0700
From:    Kristen Fife <fenix23fyre@y.......>
Subject: Re: Crossing Over

Being a student of general vampire fiction and lore,
it is generally agreed that for someone to become a
vampire, they must ingest or come in contact with at
least a small amount of vampire blood.

I've done a lot of research in this arena as my first
book is very closely tied to the whole theory. It may
not be applicable with FK, but there are several
instances when it is shown or implied that the
fledgling must drink the master's blood, notably when
Nick brought Richard across.


>
> my new theory: If the vampire doesn't completely
> drain them, they cross
> over.

=====
http://www.fkvoyage.com/fkfanfic/fife_kristen/
"When a half-breed vampire becomes the object of Mafia revenge, the ensuing
power struggle pits immortal and mortal families against one another." -THICKER
THAN WATER
"The strength of the vampire is that people will not believe in him."

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 22:18:38 +0200
From:    CousinLucilla <cousinlucilla@f.......>
Subject: Re: Crossing Over

> Deborah Hymon wrote:

> Doris, it could mean a matter of quantity of blood taken. Liam was perhaps
> bit, but not nearly drained. Perhaps the victim has to be drained to the
> point of barely a heartbeat, and then returns after making their choice
> toward the light.

That's how I see it too. It just sprang to my mind that a character actually
makes a reference to the process of bringing someone across instead of it
just being shown ( Lacroix giving blood to Alexandra - who is not family BTW
;) and Nick; Nick trying to give blood to Alyssa)

 >But I do like this theory better than any so far.
So do I :)
It adds a little extra to the relationship between sire (question: i that
term also used for a female vampire master/mistress ?)and 'fledgling'.

Doris

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 13:28:23 -0700
From:    Knight Ranger <knightranger1228@y.......>
Subject: Re: Question concerning Nick's location in May 1980

Although they didn't exactly mention 1980, I would put
him in Chicago.  That is because Janette said he was
in Chicago before coming to Toronto.  And he confirms
it by saying he would have stayed if he knew they were
going to put lights in Wrigley Field.  Wrigley Field
was lit up in August of 1988, so he would have left
before then.  And, unless forced to move on quickly,
he probably would have been there for a few years
before that.

Just my 2 cents.  Hope it helps.

Knight Ranger

--- "David J. Duncan" <dante0220@y.......> wrote:

> Hi Everyone,
>
> Does anyone know where Nick was in 1980?
>
> My inclination is to put him and LC in Boston or Chicago.

=====
e-mail:  KnightRanger1228@y.......  - or -  KnightRanger4ver@y.......
Geraint Wyn Davies Fan for Life!  (GWDFC/GWDN)
Dark Knightie/Nick & Nat Packer/Caddy Whack/FOREVER KNIGHT Die Hard
BLACK HARBOUR Lobster Yacht Lot/Harbour Light  ** -- GAIRWOLFpack -- **
GerII/Bridging/Indecency/Swindon98/NNP98/GerIV/Tucson99/Wolfville99/Wolfville01/GerVI/NNP02/Stratford02(MFL/DNGG)/Wolfville03/Paradise04/Lear04/Cyrano04


------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 28 Aug 2004 13:49:34 -0700
From:    Knight Ranger <knightranger1228@y.......>
Subject: Re: Crossing Over/Terms

On another thread, the term 'fledgling' is used alot
in fan fic, but in "I Will Repay", Nick calls Richard
a 'recent convert'.  I don't believe that 'fledgling'
was used in the show.

Knight Ranger
_________________

> It adds a little extra to the relationship between
sire (question: is that term also used for a female
vampire master/mistres ?)and 'fledgling'.


=====
e-mail:  KnightRanger1228@y.......  - or -  KnightRanger4ver@y.......
Geraint Wyn Davies Fan for Life!  (GWDFC/GWDN)
Dark Knightie/Nick & Nat Packer/Caddy Whack/FOREVER KNIGHT Die Hard
BLACK HARBOUR Lobster Yacht Lot/Harbour Light  ** -- GAIRWOLFpack -- **
GerII/Bridging/Indecency/Swindon98/NNP98/GerIV/Tucson99/Wolfville99/Wolfville01/GerVI/NNP02/Stratford02(MFL/DNGG)/Wolfville03/Paradise04/Lear04/Cyrano04


------------------------------

End of FORKNI-L Digest - 28 Aug 2004 (#2004-237)
************************************************

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