FORKNI-L

FORKNI-L Digest - 16 Mar 2002 to 17 Mar 2002 (#2002-80)

Sun, 17 Mar 2002

There are 8 messages totalling 297 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. watching Fk thoughts (3)
  2. LC in Cleveland? (3)
  3. Admin: Rules and shamrocks (also real rocks)
  4. Nick and religious items

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Date:    Sat, 16 Mar 2002 17:59:45 EST
From:    Jeannie Ecklund <Gersknightlady@c.......>
Subject: Re: watching Fk thoughts

Who do you think brought Elise (Alyse?) across in Dark Knight?

Do you think Nick knew she was watching as he was leaving the museum?

Jeannie

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Date:    Sun, 17 Mar 2002 09:34:46 +0800
From:    Elliza Rahim <relliza@h.......>
Subject: Re: LC in Cleveland?

<snip>a very large black Ford pick-up decked out with chrome and extremely
dark tinted windows, and the licensee plates read: URPREY.<snip>

Hmm...LC's usual Jaguar must have been in the shop eh? Can't see The General
being a pick-up owner even a black and chrome one...A Jag or Beemer seems
more his type.

Nick and his Caddy are definitely well-matched (ignoring the morgue-green
paint job, here>

If Janette owned a car, what would it be?

Ell

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Date:    Sat, 16 Mar 2002 17:53:45 -0800
From:    Liz the Lucky <luckyliz@c.......>
Subject: Re: LC in Cleveland?

Ell asked:
 > If Janette owned a car, what would it be?

She did own a car, and we've seen it in Cherry Blossoms. It's a red
sports car (don't know the make), and it's also a convertible.

There was another car in Human Factor, that she and Patrick spent the
day in, and got shot at, in, but that could easily have been Robert's
before he died.


Hugs and Kisses,
          Liz the Lucky                    luckyliz@a.......
            http://www.luckyliz.crosswinds.net/ForeverKnight/
                  Butt-kickin' for Goodness!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Date:    Sat, 16 Mar 2002 10:03:41 -0800
From:    Kelly C Smith <tigrlady2u@j.......>
Subject: Re: LC in Cleveland?

>snip< If Janette owned a car, what would it be?

 I'm thinking some sporty little car (a porsche or something similar).
Definitely either red or black, and *not* a convertible (too hard on the
hair!).

KC Smith
tigrlady2u@j.......

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Date:    Sat, 16 Mar 2002 10:06:01 -0800
From:    Kelly C Smith <tigrlady2u@j.......>
Subject: Re: watching Fk thoughts

On Sat, 16 Mar 2002 17:59:45 EST Jeannie Ecklund <Gersknightlady@c.......>
writes:
> Who do you think brought Elise (Alyse?) across in Dark Knight?
> Do you think Nick knew she was watching as he was leaving the museum?

 I always thought that LaCroix brought her across... as a kind of revenge
on Nick.  Also, I don't think he knew that she was there, as his comment
led me to believe that he thought her to be dead.

KC Smith
tigrlady2u@j.......

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Date:    Sun, 17 Mar 2002 08:04:07 -0500
From:    Patty Costantino <psmoot43@h.......>
Subject: Re: watching Fk thoughts

KC wrote:  Also, I don't think he (Nick) knew that she (Alyce) was there, as
his comment led me to believe that he thought her to be dead.

Or...maybe the disconcertion that he (Nick) had just been told by Nat about
his partner's blood donation to him, that Grade A Schanke blood was coursing
through him at that very moment, was such a distraction for him; he couldn't
pick up any vamp vibes from a newly created sister!  The shock to his system
was too great!  :-) Just kidding!


Patty
N&Npacker, Knightie with dark Tendencies and Light Cousin if he behaves.

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Date:    Sun, 17 Mar 2002 10:21:15 -0500
From:    mclisa <mclisa@m.......>
Subject: Admin: Rules and shamrocks (also real rocks)

Well, it _is_ St. Patrick's Day! Be grateful that McLisa can't remember the
words to any Irish songs except The Wearin' o' the Green, and couldn't
figure out how to filk that one. >


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Date:    Sun, 17 Mar 2002 11:35:52 -0800
From:    "Amy R." <akr@l.......>
Subject: Re: Nick and religious items

        Back on March 4 (I'm only just catching up on digests) Judy raised
a thread regarding "Nick and religious items" and specifically inquired,
"[W]hat would happen if [Nick] went to India and tried to drink cow blood?
Cows are considered sacred objects there."

        I think that FK canon demonstrates that what will or won't affect
FK vampires is continuous -- that is, location and time do not seem to
alter the impact that certain objects do or don't have on a specific FK
vampire.  What affects Nick in Bismark will affect him in Bombay, and what
has no affect in Toronto will have no affect in Tokyo.  The only evidence
for change in reaction is by the changes Nick has made in himself ("For I
Have Sinned").

        Now, given the affect is universal (that is, regardless of location
or time), the affect can still equally come from the vampire's own beliefs,
the beliefs of the fashioner or holder of the object, pure God-given
sanctity, or a number of other scenarios depending on one's interpretation.

      So, for the purposes of interpretations other than the one in which
it's the vampire's own beliefs that drive reaction, why does Nick not react
to cows in regard to their status in Hinduism?

      Years ago, there was a thread on list regarding "Partners of the
Month," in which Nick shies away from a menorah.  As I recall, this
depiction sparked periodic discussion of a distinction between the
canonical FK impact of _sacred_ objects and that of _ritual_ objects.  Some
listmembers felt that the episode should have depicted him balked by a
mezuzah instead, but that as it did not, it widened the range of things
that affect Nick.  Those who had access to a copy of the script then
reported that it called for there to be a number of items at the house that
made Nick uncomfortable (including a menorah and a star of David, but _not_
a mezuzah) and that the script identifies no one object as the trigger --
merely the cumulative discomfort of ritual objects, rather than the
immediate repulsion of a sacred object.

      Perhaps this applies to cows in Hinduism?  A distinction between
sacred and ritual?

      For the joy of analysis, I located this passage in a FAQ on Hinduism
(http://www.dadayama.com/puja/faq.htm):  "Why do Hindus consider cows
sacred? The cow was the most important animal of the Arya, regarded in much
the same way that the Buffalo were by the American Indians. Cattle provided
the Arya with milk, clothing and as work animals. They even measured their
wealth by how many cows they owned. However, the breed of cattle indigenous
to India is not a particularly good source of meat. To slaughter cows for
food would have been a waste of their other resources. Over time, the
importance of this animal took on a form of sacredness. Today, cows are
given a unique measure of respect by Hindus and it is still common to see
them wandering freely the streets of Indian cities."

      Perhaps, by "form of sacredness" and "unique measure of respect," the
cow falls into the category of "ritual object" rather than that of "sacred
object," thus largely freeing Nick in regards to bovines?

      On the other hand, perhaps a living cow would affect Nick, as the
sacred cow is not killed?  (We've never seen Nick with a living cow, have
we?  In the barn in "Dying to Know You," he grooms a horse.)

      Or perhaps some of the repulsion of a sacred object stays with the
cow blood, and Nick is flagellating himself through his choice of
sustenance. <g>


Amy R.
akr@l.......
FK Site: http://users.LMI.net/~akr/fk/

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End of FORKNI-L Digest - 16 Mar 2002 to 17 Mar 2002 (#2002-80)
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