FORKNI-L

FORKNI-L Digest - 5 Mar 2002 to 6 Mar 2002 (#2002-69)

Wed, 6 Mar 2002

There are 16 messages totalling 431 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. A Matter of Influence
  2. Nick and religious items (2)
  3. List digest archives site
  4. [Fwd: Re: Differences between Angel & FK]
  5. Differences between Angel & FK (8)
  6. Thesis (2)
  7. NK's "Deja Vu"

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Date:    Tue, 5 Mar 2002 16:05:56 -0700
From:    Megan Hull <mistryder@h.......>
Subject: Re: A Matter of Influence

>What (if any) influence do you think the fact that Divia brought Lacroix
>across and that she crossed the moral border for him by asking him to
>become her lover had on the type of vampire in became over the centuries?

To me, it seemed that LaCroix was extreemly attached to Divia, and probably
spoiled her rotten.  The fact that she turned out the way she did was
probably a huge betrayal to him.  That would account somewhat (thought not
entirely) for his subsequent harshness and coldness toward Nicholas and
Janette.
My other thought on the matter comes from the fact that I've had a lot of
free time on my hands of late, and decided to do some research.  The more I
read, the more I come to the conclusion that LaCroix isn't necessarily cold,
or cruel, or manipulative, or controling, or even decadent.  He's just very
VERY Roman.  Most to all of the prefrences and attitudes he desplays were
common during his mortal life-- I'm not surprised he carried them with him
into immortality.
                          -Megan

"Eternal nights too short,
How quickly melt away,
With all the love we shared once,
Forever in a day."

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 5 Mar 2002 15:57:40 -0800
From:    Viv <viv11374@y.......>
Subject: Re: Nick and religious items

--- DanaKnight@a....... wrote:

>
> Or has my masive FK pig out over the last while totally fried
> my brain, or driven me nuts?
>
> Judy
Now how **do** I answer that?

Here's a better question: the novels, which I've always
considered semi-canon, said that Vachon isn't affected by crosses
because as a mortal he was a Marrano, so why is Lacroix, a pagan,
affected by them?

=====
Viv

Don't annoy the crazy person

Life's a witch and then you fly

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 5 Mar 2002 19:08:59 -0500
From:    Nancy Braman <knightwind68@h.......>
Subject: List digest archives site

For the benefit of those who missed the announcement of the change, and for
any newbies to the list since last August, the list digests are at:

http://knightwind1228.tripod.com/forkni.htm

I'm currently working on a revised layout for this page, and hope it will be
up soon.

From your archiver,
Nancy Braman knightwind68@h....... knightwind1228@y.......
http://knightwind1228.tripod.com/
"What time is it...what day is it...what century is it?"
   --Nick (Forever Knight)
"Good morning" is an oxymoron. -- Me

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 5 Mar 2002 17:11:30 -0800
From:    preston kim <strawbearylover3@y.......>
Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: Differences between Angel & FK]

 I could be very well wrong but isn't there an episode when LaCroix
refers to it as "this swill you insist on drinking?" Not sure if it is the
memory of an episode or that voice that sounds like Lacroix in my head <eg>
Kim
  Kristin <kris1228@s.......> wrote: No he did not, just expressed distaste.

Kristin
http://knightvision.4ever.cc
"When you only have eyes for the Knight..."

> Did LaCroix actually comment on Nick having bovine thoughts?
 Kit
 urtikit@m.......


------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 00:16:49 EST
From:    MadiHolmes@a.......
Subject: Re: Differences between Angel & FK

In a message dated 03/04/02 6:58:15 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
liv@z....... writes:


> Yes, that is the episode when Spike does the wonderful monologue about
>


What is it with vampires with British accents and monologues?

MadIHolmes

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 00:21:02 EST
From:    MadiHolmes@a.......
Subject: Re: Differences between Angel & FK

In a message dated 03/04/02 5:23:18 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
liv@z....... writes:


> since the FK vamps back away from crosses. The Buffy
> vamps do, too, of course, but they really are demons possessing
> corpses, and crosses may have, in the Buffyverse, have been adopted by
> the Christian church because they are symbols that repel vampires.
>

Well, in FK, even Egyptian motifs "repelled" vampires, and a cross is
basically a pared down version of an Ankh. I'm sure there's some overlap
here, but other things differ like the whole "invitation" thing wouldn't have
done well in policework. Although Nick was always asking "Can we come in?"
Has Buffy vamps repelled at other things?

MadiHolmes

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 00:22:44 EST
From:    MadiHolmes@a.......
Subject: Re: Differences between Angel & FK

In a message dated 03/04/02 11:33:17 AM US Mountain Standard Time,
Libratsie@a....... writes:


> By the way, someone indicated that in the Buffyverse, the vampires aren't
> "disguised" and don't live as humans. They very well could pass,
> actually, since they can eat food and do more "human" things than
> even the FK vampires. They just don't seem to do so as much, from what I've
>


We only saw a few of the FK vamps, and several were pretty much outcasts from
other vamps. I doubt it was a vampire societal norm. For all we know, the
rest are all holed up in a German castle, and order delivery... a lot.

MadiHolmes

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 16:54:52 +0800
From:    Elliza Rahim <relliza@h.......>
Subject: Re: Differences between Angel & FK

>MadI wrote: What is it with vampires with British accents and monologues?

It's TPTB - they know what wonderful impact it has on female fans..."thrills
down your spine" and all that.

Ell

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:18:10 EST
From:    Libratsie@a.......
Subject: Re: Differences between Angel & FK

In a message dated 3/5/02 11:22:11 PM Central Standard Time,
MadiHolmes@a....... writes:

<< Has Buffy vamps repelled at other things? >>
There's been hints at garlic as Buffy has used it, but I don't think it has
ever actually been SEEN repelling anyone... And Spike loves spicy foods,
including those that have a lot of garlic like Spicy Buffalo Wings. In FK,
garlic definitely has an effect on Nick!

The only religious item I can remember repelling anything in BtVS is the
cross, whereas in FK, other religious items can harm a vampire.

Libby

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:21:52 EST
From:    Libratsie@a.......
Subject: Re: Differences between Angel & FK

In a message dated 3/6/02 2:56:01 AM Central Standard Time,
relliza@h....... writes:

<< >MadI wrote: What is it with vampires with British accents and monologues?

 It's TPTB - they know what wonderful impact it has on female fans..."thrills
 down your spine" and all that. >>
And in FK, both Nigel Bennett and Greg Kramer ARE originally British, James
(Spike) is not.

What... Screed has a "wonderful impact on female fans" and "thrills down your
spine"???

OOOOH! *snork* Proof at last!

Libs

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 08:31:09 -0500
From:    Lisa McDavid <mclisa@m.......>
Subject: Re: Nick and religious items

Viv writes:
>Here's a better question: the novels, which I've always
>considered semi-canon, said that Vachon isn't affected by crosses
>because as a mortal he was a Marrano, so why is Lacroix, a pagan,
>affected by them?

To each his/her own, but the writers of the novels were told they didn't have to
be consistent with each other. Of course with FK that's nothing new. <eg>

I see the Vachon not affected by crosses -- a point I don't think the series
every showed -- as a mistake like the Battle of Hastings and FK vampires not
having blood of their own.  It is full canon, from the First Nations knife to
the menorah to the Egyptian ra image that vampires are affected by religious
symbols regardless of their mortal affiliation, if any.  Nick certainly was a
medieval western Christian, which should mean that the menorah and the knife
would't bother him, if it's only the mortal life religion.

Someone on here suggested, back when Killer Instinct was first run, that LC was
so disgusted with Nick's makeshift cross stunt that he left. :)

McLisa
mclisa@m.......

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 09:16:50 -0500
From:    liv <liv@z.......>
Subject: Re: Differences between Angel & FK

On Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:18:10 EST, Libratsie@a....... wrote:

>In a message dated 3/5/02 11:22:11 PM Central Standard Time,
>MadiHolmes@a....... writes:
>
><< Has Buffy vamps repelled at other things? >>
>There's been hints at garlic as Buffy has used it, but I don't think it has
>ever actually been SEEN repelling anyone... And Spike loves spicy foods,
>including those that have a lot of garlic like Spicy Buffalo Wings. In FK,
>garlic definitely has an effect on Nick!
>
>The only religious item I can remember repelling anything in BtVS is the
>cross, whereas in FK, other religious items can harm a vampire.
-------------
There is a wonderful scene in one of the BTVS, when she gives a
vampire holy water to drink. There is a delayed reaction, and he burns
from within. I think that in Buffy the cross and so on have an effect
on vampires that isn't actually religious, where in FK, the effect
seems to depend in part on the belief of the vampires in their own
corruption and the holyness of the items. In Highlander, the TV show,
I seem to remember that any holy ground was holy, and Duncan used to
go hang out on some old Amerindian sacred ground.

My impression of FK is that in the third season, the one with Vachon
and Tracy, it suddenly became a lot more 'religious'--before, it was
hard to tell if vampirism was a real thing or a state of mind, and
suddenly it became something that was definitely real and unholy. At
the same time, of course, there were shows like the vampire dog that
seemed to go against that idea.


liv
liv@g.......
take out the garbage to reply...

If you can't beat your computer at chess try kickboxing.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 09:34:56 -0500
From:    Portia Eins <portia1@m.......>
Subject: Re: Differences between Angel & FK

Holy water definitely harms BTVS vamps -- Buffy and Angel tossed bottles of it
at attacking vamps in "Lover's Walk."  So that's another thing FK and BTVS have
in common -- but it's superficial, as I believe most of the similarities are.
"Angel" is certainly not, in my opinion, an FK knock-off.

Portia

Forever Knight TV show <FORKNI-L@l.......> wrote:

The only religious item I can remember repelling anything in BtVS is the
cross, whereas in FK, other religious items can harm a vampire.

Libby

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 10:34:54 -0700
From:    Rose Thatcher <dreamerextrodanar@h.......>
Subject: Thesis

With Listmommy's permission:
I've got a thesis paper to do, and I'm doing it on vampires.  In general,
not just FK vampires.  So, refering to all vampires, in all the different,
twisted universes, I have a question.

Why are vampires so fun to write about?

I know there are a lot of quick answers, but seriously, what's the draw?  I
need a lot of author's viewpoints, even the amature authors.  And the opinon
of non-authors, so don't go thinking you can't answer because you don't
write.  Off list or on, I think this is on topic enough to go on. :)
Thanks!
                     'Rose (who's dreaming more of chocolate than her paper
right now.)

Rome was not built by holding committe meetings.  It was done by killing all
those who opposed them.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 12:29:14 -0800
From:    Victor Roscetti <dragonslair_08060@y.......>
Subject: Re: Thesis

> Why are vampires so fun to write about?
>
 I CAN give you a quick answer. I'm a fan of Anne
Rice, Vampire the Masquerade, Bram Stoker's Dracula,
Buffy and Angel, Blade, Dracula 2000, All the Bela
Lagosi Vampire films, Chistopher Lee Hammer films,
Ultra Violet (a show from the UK - on DVD now! Go buy
it! And soon a US version.), Kindred, AND OF COURSE
Anything related to Forever Knight and there is a
simple answer. Though it is long.

      It is the forbidden, the unknown, the sexuality,
the lure of the eternal (in it's darker respects), and
their (seeming) invulnerability (Although they have to
stay away from sunlight, garlic, and stakes!)

            Vic Roscetti

=====
Dragon's Lair Studios has new recordings on CD and Cassette! Visit at
http://www.dragonsroar.com/index.htm  for updates and product info.We specialize
in Forever Knight Dramas and Parodies, also Star Trek - all profits go to
Charity! Dragon's Lair Studios supports Children's Hospital. We now accept
credit card payments!

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 6 Mar 2002 16:35:49 EST
From:    Judith Lieberman <JudithL21@a.......>
Subject: Re: NK's "Deja Vu"

Portia;  You echo my thoughts.  I too have read Deja Vu more then once.  A
wonderful piece and a would have made a lovely and thoughtful ending.  JudyL

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End of FORKNI-L Digest - 5 Mar 2002 to 6 Mar 2002 (#2002-69)
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