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FORKNI-L Digest - 21 Jan 2001 to 22 Jan 2001 (#2001-24)

Mon, 22 Jan 2001

There are 25 messages totalling 696 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Raven Awards (2)
  2. Nick's Failures as a Sire (4)
  3. all this talk of Sci-Fi channe... (2)
  4. Raffle #29
  5. Chicago Cow exhibit & YKYBWFKTMW.... (2)
  6. Nick as sire (4)
  7. Admin: ANother AOL6.0 problem (3)
  8. on writing fan fiction (2)
  9. difference between FK and Angel (etc.)
 10. Janette & Revenge (was:Re: Nick as sire)
 11. NICK AS SIRE
 12. author search (2)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 21 Jan 2001 13:03:10 -0800
From:    Cloud <clouddancer@h.......>
Subject: Re: Raven Awards

> Sandra wrote:
> Can someone tell me what website has info about the Raven Awards?

For those interested, the Raven Awards page is at Knightraven's site:

http://www.vivacehealth.co.nz/ravenawards.htm

--
Cloud         <clouddancer@h.......>
Vaquera, Incarnate, Lonely Heart, Valentine,
Soņadore & closet Night Haven

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:03:19 +1300
From:    Knightraven <knightraven@c.......>
Subject: Re: Raven Awards

> Here you go: http://home.clear.net.nz/pages/knightraven/

> >Can someone tell me what website has information about the Raven Awards?
> >The bookmark I had for it doesn't work.  Thanks.
> >--Sandra Gray, forever Knightie

Thanks Portia & Cloud! And any questions can be directed to me!<G>

Kylie.
knightraven@c.......
http://home.clear.net.nz/pages/knightraven

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 21 Jan 2001 16:22:45 -0800
From:    Liz the Lucky <luckyliz@m.......>
Subject: Re: Nick's Failures as a Sire

I've often wondered if the 'failure' wasn't so much Nick's parenting ability
as his choice of offspring.

Take a look at the successful vamps whose mortal lives we know about. All of
them were rough, to say the least. Nick, LC and Vachon were all soldiers --
killers. Screed was a sailor, which was also an abusive lifestyle,
especially if he was in the British navy. Janette was a prostitute. Urs was
abandoned by her father and wound up singing for men, if not a prostitute
herself.

Now look at the ones of Nick's who didn't make it. Elizabeth -- a spoiled
brat who only cared about how many men she could twist around her little
finger. Gerard -- dedicated, idealistic physician who wanted to heal the
sick. Richard -- dedicated, idealistic lawyer, who'd always been sheltered
by his big sister.

So maybe they just didn't have the mindset or experience needed to handle
all the new emotions and urges.

Of course, not being very cheesy, I fully expect everyone to ignore this.
;-)

Hugs and Kisses,
Liz the Lucky                                               FoD
luckyliz@m.......                                     Merc
http://www.mindspring.com/~luckyliz                         Nothers

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 21 Jan 2001 13:09:40 -0700
From:    Keoki Harman <inion_daughter@h.......>
Subject: Re: all this talk of Sci-Fi channe...

>
>Hi,
>     Coming out of lurkdom to make a comment on Luc's post.

Also coming out of lurkdom to make a comment on your post.

>I notice that after FK was removed from Sci-Fi's morning line-up, all of
>the lists got a lot quieter.  Now, I really liked the show, don't get me
>wrong,but I also love all the FK communities I subscribe to and would hate
>to see them dwindle out because the show is off the air.

Diddo.  Except people like me who don't get the Sci-Fi chanel and have found
our way to these web communitys.  I rely on friends who get show case and
are willing to tape fairy/let me come over and watch it.

>Also don't see nearly the amount of new list members since the show is
>gone.

I'm a new member!

Steph, who will be making an introduction post very soon.

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 21 Jan 2001 21:33:58 -0000
From:    Barbara Vainio <bevainio@w.......>
Subject: Re: Nick's Failures as a Sire

 Brenda Bell wrote:
>Perhaps
> Lacroix didn't learn this, or perhaps Nick was too headstrong to be
> mentored to -- resulting in Nick feeling he was Lacroix's slave -- or
> perhaps Lacroix was trying a new approach, because he wanted something
> different from Nicolas than he did from any others of his fledglings.
>
Brenda's comment raised the thought that perhaps LaCroix *didn't* learn
everything he should have from his "mother".  After all, Divia was powerful,
but still a fledgling when she brought LC across and a mortal child besides.
And then, of course, he killed her (about 20 years after she brought him
across, it think?).

Obviously, LC learned what he needed to survive - and prosper, but maybe
what he learned on his own wasn't easily taught to his children.  Perhaps he
had learned by trial and error.

And let's face it, LC would *not* put himself in a position to look less
than perfect to his children.  That would open a can of worms he wouldn't
want to deal with :-)

Barb

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 21 Jan 2001 21:51:01 -0000
From:    Barbara Vainio <bevainio@w.......>
Subject: Re: Nick's Failures as a Sire

Liz the Lucky wrote:

> Take a look at the successful vamps whose mortal lives we know about. All of
> them were rough, to say the least.

I like this idea.  In addition to the names mentioned there was Serena.  She
*hated* being a vampire, but survived.  As a mortal, she was very
independent and had made a life for herself that was different from many of
her peers.

Francesca also seemed to be a pretty tough woman.  She certainly found way
to stay around even after Nick killed her :-)

Barb

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 21 Jan 2001 22:07:59 -0500
From:    Portia 1 <portia1@m.......>
Subject: Re: Nick's Failures as a Sire

>Now look at the ones of Nick's who didn't make it. Elizabeth -- a spoiled
>brat who only cared about how many men she could twist around her little
>finger. Gerard -- dedicated, idealistic physician who wanted to heal the
>sick. Richard -- dedicated, idealistic lawyer, who'd always been sheltered
>by his big sister.

Liz, this is a really cool idea!  You're basically saying that a moralistic
and/or a weak charactered personality doesn't have the "character" strength
to deal with the violent/aggressive drives of being a vampire (I think).
And that's a view I haven't thought of before.  Neat! "g"

Portia

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 21 Jan 2001 23:21:24 -0500
From:    "Susan M. Garrett" <susanmgarrett@e.......>
Subject: Raffle #29

We have exactly 17 entries signed up for the current raffle.

I don't know whether it's the prize, or the post holiday thaw, or a lack of
Forever Knight fans out there.

It's rather disheartening.  But it is a VERY good chance to win
something.  heaven knows, the next item will be something signed and I've
had an average of 20+ entries for the last couple of raffles.  When do you
ever have a one in 20 chance of winning anything?

http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/2167/raffle.htm

susanmgarrett@e.......  -- http://home.earthlink.net/~susanmgarrett/
EVER Faithful Ravenette. http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/2167/fiction.htm
"Friends help you move.  Real friends help you move bodies."

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 02:43:58 EST
From:    DanaKnight@a.......
Subject: Chicago Cow exhibit & YKYBWFKTMW....

Yes, this is FK relevant.

I was looking at the book about the Chicago Cow exhibit that a friend of my
dad's sent him for Christmas. One of the cows showed the various cuts of meat
that come out of the cow, and had veins/arteries leading from those to the
heart and down into green wine bottles. The artist had to be a FK fan, or why
else would they have had cow blood going into green wine bottles? I
immediately thought of Nick as soon as I saw the bottles.

YKYBWFKTMW.... you start spelling steak as stake without thinking about it.

Judy

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:59:31 -0800
From:    Lisa McDavid <cecily1349@y.......>
Subject: Nick as sire

It's just occurred to me that both of Nick's failures
were revenge-oriented. Certainly Richard Lambert had
been a prosecuting attorney as a mortal, which is a
morally acceptible way to seek revenge and a very
neccesary one. He may even be better described as
seeking justice and honestly believing, as a vampire,
that he was dealing out justice. But then he killed a
victim who just happened to be in the wrong place at
the wrong time when he went after the criminals.

Elizabeth wanted revenge against not only the men who
were about to rape her when they realized she was a
leper and tried to kill her instead. Again, that part
could be regarded as justice. But she also made it
clear that she wanted revenge on all the people who
had shunned her after she contracted leprosy.

Serena, OTOH, wasn't after revenge on anyone. She
didn't even appear to want anything from Nick except
for him to stay away from her.

Maybe whether or not the new vampire gets out of
control depends in part on his/her drives as a mortal.

McLisa
mclisa@m.......

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:19:41 -0800
From:    "David J. Duncan" <dante0220@y.......>
Subject: Re: Nick as sire

Hi Everyone:

I seem to remember that from time to time in the
show, it was mentioned that emotions are
increased as someone is brought across.  In the
case of Adolf Hitler (the corporal on the train),
LC decides against bringing him across because of
the increased rage and hatred.  (Perhaps he had
learned from the Barber experience????)

Thanks for listening!

David

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:21:39 -0800
From:    Lisa McDavid <cecily1349@y.......>
Subject: Admin: ANother AOL6.0 problem

I've just been told that apparently AOL now insists on
including the whole previous message when you reply. I
don't know if this can be turned off.

This feature of AOL6.0 helps explain the epidemic of
full quotes lately. So, if you're on AOL6.0, please
check before you send Forkni-l a reply post.  If it
has added the post to which you are replying, please
take it out. If this can't be done, then please start
out with new mail to the list and use cut and paste
for quotes.

Thanks,

McLisa, who is reminded lately of why some people call
it "AOHELL" :)
mclisa@m.......

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:27:28 EST
From:    Libratsie@a.......
Subject: Re: Admin: ANother AOL6.0 problem

<<McLisa, who is reminded lately of why some people call
it "AOHELL" :)>>

That's why us "experienced" AOL users NEVER upgrade until all the stupid new
features are exposed for what they are. I sometimes think LaCroix really owns
the company and loves to play with our mortal minds through AOL.

I've been using AOLnetmail at work for ages now, and with it you also can only
quote the full message. However, once you get use to cutting out the stuff you
don't need to repost, it really is no more trouble than highlighting what you
WANT quoted in "classic AOL."

--libs

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:17:40 -0800
From:    Klytaimnestra <lbowman@c.......>
Subject: on writing fan fiction

Things it never occurred to me I'd do ... for the FK story I'm working on, I
found myself spending 2 hours last night designing a scale diagram of Nat's
condo in Vancouver, so I could have it firmly in mind while I write.  Since
none of this information will ever show up in the story, I just wanted to
tell someone that she has 1000 sq. ft. on the 12th floor, corner suite, sun
porch off the master bedroom, ensuite Jacuzzi, good-size second bedroom,
also a den with no natural light, gee, why would that come in handy ... huge
living/dining area and another glassed-in balcony off the kitchen, to grow
herbs.  Hey, even in Canada, doctors make a decent living ...:)

But it never occurred to me that I would need to know any of this to write a
story!

Laurel
--
Klytaimnestra             lbowman@c.......
Fanfiction at http://members.home.net/lbowman

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:25:41 -0800
From:    Klytaimnestra <lbowman@c.......>
Subject: difference between FK and Angel (etc.)

Lately I've watched a couple of episodes of Angel, and of Buffy.  I was
trying to figure out why those shows are surviving and the far superior FK
is gone.  The obvious reason is greater popular appeal, but why? I think the
differences come down to a few key things:

- real people (FK) vs. cartoons (Angel)
- moral conflict (FK) vs. personal conflict (Angel)
- some attempt at realism (FK) vs. choreographed cartoon martial-arts type
violence (Angel)

I can't deny that the fight scenes in Angel, or Buffy for that matter, are
fun to watch; and they obviously had more money to spend on special effects.
But the stories, the characters, the questions they ask, are so
two-dimensional. Is a little martial-arts eye-candy really all it takes? Or
are the cartoon characters, questions and plots in Angel part of the appeal?

K
--
Klytaimnestra             lbowman@c.......
Fanfiction at http://members.home.net/lbowman

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:40:28 -0600
From:    Margie Hammet <treeleaf@i.......>
Subject: Re: Nick as sire

At 08:59 AM 1/22/01 -0800, Lisa McDavid wrote:
>It's just occurred to me that both of Nick's failures
>were revenge-oriented.

The doctor in "Fever" also killed too many people for safety, and he wasn't
revenge-oriented.

OTOH, Janette clearly was revenge-oriented, but she didn't get out of control.

>Maybe whether or not the new vampire gets out of
>control depends in part on his/her drives as a mortal.

I think that's very likely true.  In the case of the doctor, he may have
had drives that Nick wasn't aware of.   He may not have been truly
altruistic, as Nick believed, but motivated more out of a desire for his
own importance.

But then, that still leaves the question of Janette.

Bring 'em back alive!
Margie (treeleaf@i.......)
Cousin of the Knight ~ N&NPacker
CotK Site -- http://lavender.fortunecity.com/evildead/879/

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:44:47 -0600
From:    Margie Hammet <treeleaf@i.......>
Subject: Re: Nick as sire

At 09:19 AM 1/22/01 -0800, David J. Duncan wrote:

>In the case of Adolf Hitler (the corporal on the train), LC decides
>against bringing him across because of the increased rage and
>hatred.  (Perhaps he had learned from the Barber experience????)

I've got a question about the Barber.  Was there any clue in the show as to
whether LC originally intended to bring the Barber across, or was he just
planning on having him for lunch?

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:08:37 -0800
From:    "David J. Duncan" <dante0220@y.......>
Subject: Janette & Revenge (was:Re: Nick as sire)

Hi Everyone:

On the question of Janette...LC channeled her
need for revenge and allowed her to satisfy it.
("Revenge for the sake of revenge..."--was that
the translation of the quote???)

Now, if she is double-crossed (see Celeste for
example), Janette can be pretty focused and nasty
to deal with....

Just a few thoughts.

Thanks

David

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:12:44 -0500
From:    Portia 1 <portia1@m.......>
Subject: Re: on writing fan fiction

Forever Knight TV show <FORKNI-L@l.......> wrote:
But it never occurred to me that I would need to know any of this to write a
story!
Laurel<<<

LOL!  I just spent a half hour examining pictures of Nigel to get a good view of
his fingers, to see if he had long 'uns or blunt 'uns! (As I should have
guessed, he has the artist's long fingers -- darn it. "g")

Portia

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:46:12 EST
From:    Spaine3@a.......
Subject: Re: Chicago Cow exhibit & YKYBWFKTMW....

There is a popular and relatively inexpensive red wine known as Bull's Blood
--Hungarian, if memory serves--that my husband and I used to drink in our
young,impoverished student days.

I always thought it should be among the vintages that Janette stocked in the
Raven.

Sue Paine

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:51:01 EST
From:    Paula Newman <RAVENSFYRE67@a.......>
Subject: Re: NICK AS SIRE

At 1:42:26 PM , 1/22/2001  Margie Hammet asked:

>I've got a question about the Barber. Was there any clue in the show as to
>whether LC originally intended to bring the Barber across, or was he just
>planning on having him for lunch?

In the scene where LC is being comforted by Jeannette as he is fighting the
poisonous blood of the Barber, he tell Nick that he had intended to drain him.
And that he thought that the Barber's incredible evil wouldn't affect him.

Paula


------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:19:55 -0500
From:    Cecilia Long <celong@m.......>
Subject: Re: Admin: ANother AOL6.0 problem

Thank you for the update...

--
Cecilia
Lady Ariadne--webmistress
http://www.wildbadgers.net
ICQ# 10820105
--

I've just been told that apparently AOL now insists on
including the whole previous message when you reply. I
don't know if this can be turned off.

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:00:07 EST
From:    KnghtWtch@a.......
Subject: Re: author search

In a message dated 1/20/01 11:42:46 PM Eastern Standard Time,
mrodri14@u....... writes:

<< I appreciate Nancy (?I think it's her) getting stories togehter since
 fkfanfic hans't been updated, b/c I'm not on fkfic-l.  So please, make
 those stories available so *all* of us can read them!  Send her your
 stories! (so I get to read them!)
  >>
Nancy does a great job, true.  And even though Mel hasn't updated her site, I
still have had a lot of fic to read.  If you sub to the fic list, you'll have
enough to keep you busy until the site is updated.  I would estimate about
175 stories posted there since the last update of fkfanfic.com.
KnightWitch ;-]=

CaddyWhacker, Die Hard, Ravenette with Enforcement tendencies.
A Unique line of Forever Knight apparel is now available at:
http://hometown.aol.com/knghtwtch/index.html .....and.....
http://home.clear.net.nz/knightraven/pages.html

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:10:14 EST
From:    KnghtWtch@a.......
Subject: Re: all this talk of Sci-Fi channe...

In a message dated 1/21/01 9:13:55 PM Eastern Standard Time,
inion_daughter@h....... writes:

<< >Also don't see nearly the amount of new list members since the show is
 > >gone.

 I'm a new member!
  >>
In a sence, I too am a new member.  I joined the list Jun 97.  After the show
was off the aire.  I wasn't aware of the list until my son did a search on
his computer and showed it to me.   I was then 'brought across' to the list.
And will stay with it to it's  end.  I just recently gave up running the list
over at compuserve since they dropped the Forever Knight forum over there
last year.
KnightWitch;-]=

CaddyWhacker, Die Hard, Ravenette with Enforcement tendencies.
A Unique line of Forever Knight apparel is now available at:
http://hometown.aol.com/knghtwtch/index.html .....and.....
http://home.clear.net.nz/knightraven/pages.html

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:36:11 -0500
From:    STEPHANIE KELLERMAN <stephke@i.......>
Subject: Re: author search

And there is always the FTP site.

Steph
stephke@i.......
ftp://ftp.win.net/winnet/fkvoyage/fkfanfic/

On Mon, 22 Jan 2001 KnghtWtch@a....... wrote:

> In a message dated 1/20/01 11:42:46 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> mrodri14@u....... writes:
>
> << I appreciate Nancy (?I think it's her) getting stories togehter since
>  fkfanfic hans't been updated, b/c I'm not on fkfic-l.  So please, make
>  those stories available so *all* of us can read them!  Send her your
>  stories! (so I get to read them!)
>   >>
> Nancy does a great job, true.  And even though Mel hasn't updated her site, I
> still have had a lot of fic to read.  If you sub to the fic list, you'll have
> enough to keep you busy until the site is updated.  I would estimate about
> 175 stories posted there since the last update of fkfanfic.com.
> KnightWitch ;-]=
>
> CaddyWhacker, Die Hard, Ravenette with Enforcement tendencies.
> A Unique line of Forever Knight apparel is now available at:
> http://hometown.aol.com/knghtwtch/index.html .....and.....
> http://home.clear.net.nz/knightraven/pages.html
>

------------------------------

End of FORKNI-L Digest - 21 Jan 2001 to 22 Jan 2001 (#2001-24)
**************************************************************


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