There are 21 messages totalling 698 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Your Daily Vote & FK's Postion (6) 2. FK Vidcap Collection by Episode! 3. Equal Opportunity Story Posts 4. Natalie's employer 5. CERK info (5) 6. Your Daily Vote & FK's Position 7. Your Daily Vote and FK's *increased* Position 8. KC's 1999 Fiction 9. Subject: Re: Forever Knight HAS Dropped Officially! 10. Bonds Between NewbornVampire & 1 or 2 Sires (2) 11. Fwd: Your Daily Vote & FK's Postion ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 17:38:05 EST From: Ceily Trog <Fk4ever1228@a.......> Subject: Re: Your Daily Vote & FK's Postion Scurrying out from under my rock to quickly say: The only thing that can be said for certain is that if we don't vote, then we will never know if it will have helped our cause. However, my feeling is that should there be the slightest chance that voting will help, I for one will vote until my fingers fall off. Whose to say that anything we do will help? All we be certain of is that voting and writing cannot hurt our cause and IMHO, it is worth trying! OK, back to lurkdom for me. fk4ever an eternal optimist :-) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 14:39:51 -0800 From: "Nancy A. Taylor" <nat1228@h.......> Subject: FK Vidcap Collection by Episode! My apologies for those who receive this more than once. Please feel free to pass it along to any other lists or newsgroups you think might be interested. It's done! What is probably the most comprehensive collection of Forever Knight video captures by episode anywhere on the Internet is finally complete. Thanks to the help of Linda Sriro and Mel Moser, who loaned me their vidcap collections for the project, I finally have pictures for every episode of all three seasons. Most average 30 to 100 pictures each, while several popular episodes have as many as 150. There are literally thousands of new pictures for your enjoyment --over 120 megabytes. You can view the Episode Archives at: http://members.xoom.com/nancyt1228/archives.htm I plan to slowly upgrade picture quality and quantity on some episodes, particularly first season, but the bulk of the work is done. I will now resume taking special requests for video captures. HOWEVER, I do ask that you check the episode archives first, as what you're looking for may already be there. Enjoy! Nancy Taylor -- nat1228@h....... Knightie/N&NPack/UF/GWDFC http://members.home.net/nat1228/fk.htm "The first hundred years are the hardest." --Wilson Mizner ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 18:49:37 EST From: SField8067@a....... Subject: Re: Your Daily Vote & FK's Postion In regards to the Global World Charts, i do want to say that i send them to TPTB along with the signed petiton to help the cause in bringing the show back to us all,so please if you are online take the few minutes a day to sign as many times as you are allowed,everything we do is important, now more than before! that includes snail mail,e-mail to the Sci-Fi channel,telephone calls,the works! all the best, susan ellen field KtK ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 18:34:46 -0700 From: KYER <KYER@p.......> Subject: Equal Opportunity Story Posts (Kyer takes a break from trying to figure out her computer's guts---"Where's Natalie? I need an autopsy of this *undead* thing!---in order to address a pet peeve.) (Said in nice, reasonable, don't-wanna-upset-anyone, step-on-toes, or point fingers tones:) FKFIC Gripe Alert! (again, pointed at no writer in particular---been grumbling privately about this for a **long** time!) Writers---please!---I know a lot of you enjoy doing steamy-type stuff and in no way am I saying you should stop what you enjoy. *But*, if your story is not *completely* of 'Adult' orientation, make a General Audience version of the Adult posts as well? As a 30-something, I find it aggravating to have to stop reading a good story because I have to wait for an adult part to be sent to me---or wait for JADFE to post it. I can only imagine how frustrating it would be for someone under age to read (say) 8 parts, only to find that part 9 of 10 is unavailable to them. Worse! Many of these 'Adult only' posts *also* carry information that is important to the plot. Its like trying to read a novel with some pages torn out. Huff & Puffed, (yet oddly enough wants to laugh as well), Kyer kyer@p....... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 22:58:42 -0500 From: Marg Yamanaka <mytoronto@h.......> Subject: Re: Natalie's employer DeanieBTVS@a....... wrote: However, I was watching "Spin Doctor" today, and the reporters > referred to Nat as the "county coroner." <sigh> Is that just an Americanism > creeping its way into the script? Yup! Just like 'taking the 5th' or 'murder one'. At the time of the show, Toronto used to reside in the county of York, but it has all been renamed now to York Region, Durham Region, Halton Region, etc. But the Coroner's Office is still under provincial jurisdiction. -- Marg, in Toronto, the City of the Knight <mytoronto@h.......> Please visit the Upper Canada Connection - A Canadian Tribute to Geraint Wyn Davies: http://members.home.net/gwducc/index.htm ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 23:09:52 -0500 From: Karen Tobin <LdyAngst@w.......> Subject: Re: Your Daily Vote & FK's Postion On 8 Mar 00, at 15:32, Kristin Harris wrote: > Susan Field, head of KTK, sends this chart to the Powers that Be > monthly, so yes they are important and yes you should vote at this > one, the Global 100. Just because they are forwarded doesn't mean they are read. There is only one kind of poll/chart, etc, that TV executives depend upon to make their decisions--ratings. Ratings collected and published by established, reputable experts. Ratings based upon the viewing habits of a broad sample of people. > And if any power ever did look at a chart this > would be the one. This isn't like the little voting fan booths. This > is an actual world vote. Why would "this be the one"? I visited the page and tried to find any indication of what credentials the people who run it have. There is nothing to indicate who they are or why we should take their page seriously. And why would U.S. tv executives be interested in an "actual world vote"? What does that even mean? How can anything that is so easily manipulated be meaningful? Some one posted today that he or she had voted using 2 e-mail addresses. If WE know we can increase the numbers by using multiple addresses, etc., then anyone whom we hope to impress with these charts knows it, too. ----- Karen, LdyAngst@w....... Dark and Stormy Knightie/Mistress of Understatement/Hero Librarian/ Mutant Enemy/Keeper of the Klew/BGoBH/MAS/PiC/Untuned/BGoFkN/ Uncarved/Unloved/Undarned/Unchafed/Ladyloone/KaydickHead "Yeah, yeah. The bees liked you best. Yeah, yeah." ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 23:16:04 -0600 From: Nancy Kaminski <nancykam@m.......> Subject: Re: Your Daily Vote & FK's Postion First off, let me say that if you want to vote on this chart for fun, by all means, have fun! Vote early and often! But, having said that... From: Karen Tobin <LdyAngst@w.......> > There is only one kind of poll/chart, etc, that TV executives depend > upon to make their decisions--ratings. Ratings collected and > published by established, reputable experts. Ratings based upon > the viewing habits of a broad sample of people. Yup, I'm afraid that's right. I'm sure no one in the industry pays attention to the results of this site. Kristin Harris wrote: > And if any power ever did look at a chart this > would be the one. This isn't like the little voting fan booths. This > is an actual world vote. Anything on the internet is global. *My* homesite is globally available -- which doesn't make it all that important. Karen Tobin wrote: > Why would "this be the one"? I visited the page and tried to find > any indication of what credentials the people who run it have. There > is nothing to indicate who they are or why we should take their > page seriously. It's owned by a Dutch company called Millidian. I couldn't find out anything about them. > How can anything that is so easily manipulated be meaningful? > Some one posted today that he or she had voted using 2 e-mail > addresses. If WE know we can increase the numbers by using > multiple addresses, etc., then anyone whom we hope to impress > with these charts knows it, too. I do think this site is simply a means to collect demographic information for marketing purposes, and to attract visitors who then see all the ads posted there. I read the privacy statement they recently posted. Note that it says, "Global100.com does not disclose or sell any personally identifiable information collected at this site to other companies or organizations. In the future, should Global100.com decide to share its customers' personal or transactional data with third parties, it will, in advance, provide notification and the opportunity for its users to indicate whether they would prefer the company not to provide the information to third parties." This means that, while they don't sell your personal information in a form that is "personally identifiable." They will sell the statistics, though. You're contributing info that they benefit from. It goes on to say that if they do decide to share information in the future, they will try to contact you so you can tell them not to use yours. However, if you don't respond -- let's say you change email addies -- they'll happily sell your identifiable info because you didn't tell them not to. There are other questionable clauses in their privacy statement that I won't go into here. I know lots of people enjoy playing this game -- but you all should be cognizant of the rules *they're* playing by. They don't run this elaborate site out of the goodness of their heart, they do it because it makes them money. More power to them -- e-commerce is alive and well! I won't say any more on this subject -- like I said, I know lots of people really enjoy voting. Please don't take my reservations about this whole topic as being a wet blanket and not being a true FK fan. I love the show and wish it would come back -- but I'm also a realist and know in my heart it ain't gonna happen. (sigh) Nancy Kaminski nancykam@m....... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 15:08:56 +0100 From: Debi McK <vachesang@s.......> Subject: CERK info Needed for a fanfic - in the later episodes, LaCroix would broadcast the Nightcrawler show from the Raven - but didn't he do the show from the Cerk studio somewhere in earlier eps? Does anyone know where the studio was, and is the interior shown in any ep? Debi McK ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 07:20:04 EST From: Libratsie@a....... Subject: Re: Your Daily Vote & FK's Postion In a message dated 3/8/00 11:44:34 PM Central Standard Time, nancykam@m....... writes: > Please don't take my reservations about this whole > topic as being a wet blanket and not being a true FK fan. I love the show > and wish it would come back -- but I'm also a realist and know in my heart > it ain't gonna happen. (sigh) Maybe not. But, also, even with the slimmest chance of hope there's a chance. It won't, however, happen if we sit on our duffs and do nothing. Twenty five years or so ago, people were telling me that Star Trek would never come back. Many other shows have come back if only for a reunion movie. And on the subject of the polls - I've pointed this out on other lists I'm on: maybe it doesn't mean much to TPTB, *but* other fannish sorts who are voting at the polls for other shows may look at Forever Knight and go, "I wonder what that is about - i've never heard of it!" or "Hey, I remember hearing about that show, I wonder if it is really all that good ... People keep voting for it." So, being the fannish sort of other fandoms to begin with, they do a little websearching. They stumbled across www.fkfanfic.com or other pages and start reading. Maybe they scrounge around dig up some tapes from fans or live in a country where the reruns are still being shown and get hooked. I would have NEVER watched Forever Knight if when a friend asked if he could watch the premiere of season 3 while visiting me, I hadn't kept hearing about the show. The above other fannish sorts might never watch it if they didn't keep stumbling across mentions of it on the Internet polls. Remember, even if in your heart of hearts you are sure it isn't coming back, there are things to write and fight for - in the US, this includes getting the Sci Fi Channel to start airing the reruns again! We got a 2nd CD, what about a third? There's still plenty of music. Novels. Merchandising. Videos... etc. (Good grief, you wouldn't BELIEVE the shows that Columbia Video offers on professional tapes now! FK may never have been in the top ten of tv show ratings, but neither were some of these!) So, even if you think you are just voting in the polls for the fun of voting, that vote could make a difference, even if it just attracts other fans. TPTB may not care about the actual polls, but they do care about statistics. Those new fans become a statistic, especially if they start writing letters saying, "At least start re-airing the reruns so I can see all the episodes!" Uhr, this soap box is terribly high... can someone help me down??? ;-D --Libs ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 12:37:23 -0000 From: Tracy Gooding <Tracy.Gooding@n.......> Subject: Re: Your Daily Vote & FK's Position On 09/03/0012:20 GMT Libratsie wrote (amongst many other things): <<Uhr, this soap box is terribly high... can someone help me down??? ;-D>> <Adding another layer, and a ladder> Thank goodness for some optimism after all this doom and gloom. So, I don't know if TPTB actually read the letters and emails we send. But if they do, and then we stop, what kind of message does that send? The show 'Blakes 7' has been mentioned from time to time on this list, especially as it had a similarly bleak last episode to 'Last Knight'. That show ended in the early 80's. I heard very recently that a reunion-type TV movie is still in the works pending additional funding. If they can do it after all this time, why not FK? In the meantime, more merchandising would do very nicely. Tracy Tracy.Gooding@n....... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 07:28:30 -0600 From: Kristin Harris <kris1228@s.......> Subject: Your Daily Vote and FK's *increased* Position Hello! This is just a reminder to vote for FK daily on the Gloabl 100 (the important charts). To go vote today go here: http://www.global100.com/item.asp?Item=51259 Currently it's unofficial position is #6. (if we increase this it will increase officially) Officially it is # 7. Thanks for helping! Kristin ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 10:10:49 -0500 From: Tracysue <tracysue@i.......> Subject: KC's 1999 Fiction I would like to suggest that people go read KC Susan's uproriously funny fiction (including the 1999 Snixco Catalog, How the Nix Stole Christmas, and a story that she and I co-wrote entitled How I learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Evil Pink Shirt). *Cough*Cough*Cough*nominateit*Cough*Cough*Cough* I now have a page for her fiction up at my website, http://members.xoom.com/tracysue2/Library.html There is also a link to www.fkfanfic.com to promote the fanfic contest there. -- Tracy Sue -Vaquera "One of the most basic rules for survival on any planet is never to upset someone wearing black leather.* This is why protesters against the wearing of animal skins by humans unaccountably fail to throw their paint over Hell's Angels. "-- Terry Pratchett, The Last Continent ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 10:39:43 -0500 From: Cindy Clark <clarkcindy@e.......> Subject: Re: CERK info One ep that showed the inside of the studio well was "Close Call" and also "Father's Day" if I remember right. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 02:12:53 +0000 From: jennii <jennii@c.......> Subject: Re: CERK info studio somewhere in earlier eps? Does anyone know where the studio was, and is the interior shown in any ep? You can see a view of the interior in "Father's Day" jennii Dark Knightie and UFfer jennii@c....... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 02:23:08 +0000 From: jennii <jennii@c.......> Subject: Re: CERK info One ep that showed the inside of the studio well was "Close Call" and also "Father's Day" if I remember right. Also in "Baby Baby" jennii Dark Knightie and UFfer jennii@c....... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 11:05:55 EST From: SField8067@a....... Subject: Re: Your Daily Vote & FK's Postion Regarding the Global World Charts and other things. I have to say that i personally would not continue Kickstart the Knight projects, if in my heart i felt that there was no hope for anything. Forever Knight has proven itself time and time again to be a consistant fan favorite. Do TPTB read the charts? all i can tell you is that i send them directly to the desks of Stephen Chao, Bonnie Hammer and Tristar/Sony, and anyone else i think will make things happen for us all! We do know for sure that the e-mails are being read.The new Ad coupled with huge online fan response just might do the Trick. If we all fall into a slump, thinking, "what chance do we have now cause its been awhile" then for sure we all get nothing. it only takes a few seconds to type your vote,to e-mail a letter,to sign a petiton.everyone is online anyway, and wouldn't it be great to read the news that due to overwelming fan response more Fk will happen? please guys, lets show them we are here in force! susan ellen field KtK ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 11:32:34 EST From: Laudon1965@a....... Subject: Re: CERK info In a message dated 03/08/2000 10:47:47 PM US Mountain Standard Time, vachesang@s....... writes: << Needed for a fanfic - in the later episodes, LaCroix would broadcast the Nightcrawler show from the Raven - but didn't he do the show from the Cerk studio somewhere in earlier eps? Does anyone know where the studio was, and is the interior shown in any ep? >> I don't know where it was supposed to be, but I do know that at the very least, the interior was shown in the second season ep "Close Call". Laurie of the Isles ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 14:39:13 EST From: "Doņa Angel D.S." <donaangel@h.......> Subject: Subject: Re: Forever Knight HAS Dropped Officially! Cloud <clouddancer@h.......> had said in Mon. 3-6/7 digest #2000-67-- >Kristin Harris wrote: >>GO HERE TO VOTE FOR FK: >>http://www.global100.com/item.asp?Item=51259 >>(Please try to do this daily, or atleast once a week. >Thanks for the update, Kristin. For some reason I thought you could only >vote monthly. I'll be sure to get there MUCH more often now! I second Cloud's "post"--Thanks, Kristin, for mentioning that we could vote daily--I, too, had thought that you could only vote once a month! NOW I know and will also--like a lot more FK Fans {I hope!*G*}--vote MUCH more often! ~~Angel a.k.a.Doņa Angel <donaangel@h.......> Vaquera/Future Proud Vaq Brat/VaqDreamer/INCArnate/Immortal Beloveds/Ravenette/Faithfuls/Urchin/DH/The Crew/CW/BBFC ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 15:45:15 EST From: "Doņa Angel D.S." <donaangel@h.......> Subject: Bonds Between NewbornVampire & 1 or 2 Sires Since I've relatively new to FK FanFic-dom, would y'all please give me your thoughts and tell me what is commonly accepted in FK FanFic and FK Fandom about the following: --Recalling the season 1 ep "Fatal Mistake" where Nick thinks he's drained Alexandra, and LC find's "there's still life in" her and gives her his blood, thereby completing bringing her across, would the new vampire "re-born" in such a manner have 2 vampire masters, 2 vampire father(s)/mother(s)/sires, and have vampire "ties" to each of her "parents"?--e.g. Nick and LaCroix, in that episode-- as one draining--accidentally in the "heat of a...romantic situation" or on purpose with good intentions, i.e. "to save"--the mortal from permanent death [death from illness or fatal injuries, for example], and then the other vampire giving her the necessary vampire blood--thereby, saving her from almost certain PERMANENT death and also establishing a connection, "an eternal bond", between them? And would the "ties" to one of these "parents" be equal or stronger between the new "childe" and one or both of her "parents"? What do you think? And, while I'm here and sorta on the same topic...who do ya'll think finished bringing Alyce Hunter across in "Dark Knight - The Second Chapter"--did Nick give her his blood before the paramedics took her apparently dead body away, or did LaCroix come back to her later that night and give her his blood--since we find out about 20 episodes later that LaCroix is "too old and powerful" to have been destroyed as Nick had assumed he had been? It seems to me, IMHO, that at the VERY end of the ep, when Nick was talking to Nat about Alyce, that he was telling Nat the truth and seemed like he thought that Alyce was indeed dead. He does sense the presence of another vampire--but I cannot tell if he does see Alyce up at the skylight in the museum's roof/ceiling?...Whatd'ya think? Thanks! Angel a.k.a. Doņa Angel <donaangel@h.......> Vaquera/Future Proud Vaq Brat/VaqDreamer/INCArnate/Immortal Beloveds/Ravenette/Faithfuls/Urchin/DH/The Crew/CW/BBFC ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 10:12:06 +1300 From: Knightraven <knightraven@c.......> Subject: Re: Bonds Between NewbornVampire & 1 or 2 Sires would the new vampire "re-born" in such a manner have 2 vampire masters, 2 vampire father(s)/mother(s)/sires, and have vampire "ties" to each of her > "parents Well, I think that only the giver of blood would be the sire, though being of the same family, Nick should be able to feel/sense Alexandra as his sister. Though in this instance where the blood taker was not the giver, I would imagine the link or control of the fledgling would be compromised as the sire would not be able to 'connect' to the fledgling through the child's blood as one would if he had tasted of her as well. However I believe the link can be strengthened by repeated sharing of blood over a period of time, thus bringing them up to a normal sire/fledgling level. Who do ya'll think finished bringing Alyce Hunter across in "Dark Knight - The Second Chapter" I agree that Nick thought her dead...this was definately LC's doing...but then in the realm of FKfic...it could have been anyone really...<eg> Kylie. knightraven@c....... http://home.clear.net.nz/pages/knightraven ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 16:42:10 EST From: MRKKaye@a....... Subject: Fwd: Your Daily Vote & FK's Postion In a message dated 3/8/2000 11:10:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, LdyAngst@w....... writes: << Just because they are forwarded doesn't mean they are read. >> It's just as possible that they are. <<There is only one kind of poll/chart, etc, that TV executives depend upon to make their decisions--ratings. Ratings collected and published by established, reputable experts.>> More than one(Arbitron, Nielsen, Audits & Surveys Worldwide and the centers(University of Wisconsin,University of Michigan, University of Massachusetts, George Washington University in DC, and dozens of others) that do surveys for research for PAC groups and advertisers to determine the effect of violence on teens/minority representation/marketing groups for advertisers/etc - and they don't always agree. But they have had an effect on network programming. << There is nothing to indicate who they are or why we should take their page seriously.>> They do give their names. That they give higher ratings to people who can be better associated with specific groups ie. country, sex, age group, identifiable Service Provider customers or privacy concious e-mail service users is what 'survey sampling' is about - so they seem to have the basics of valid survey sampling. <<And why would U.S. tv executives be interested in an "actual world vote"? >> SONY is not an American company. And Forever Knight has been aired in other countries. <<If WE know we can increase the numbers by using multiple addresses, etc., then anyone whom we hope to impress with these charts knows it, too.>> And the people who set the ratings can account for this in their ratings. Not necessarily on a one-to-one basis, but by simply asking ISP companies how many names a person can have, and allowing again for addy's that com from e-mail services (ie. mail.com) these can all be statistically accounted for in the 'ratings'. Of course it also explains why people who don't give any information are given much lower 'ratings'. This company seems to trying to start a legitimate 'internet' survey company -- a new and soon to be fast-growing field for survey research. What would be good would be to see what their results may be as compared to other companies that are attempting to enter this area (ie. Intersurvey, University of Wisconsin, or Audits & Surveys Worldwide). Off to e-mail them and ask about their use and/or analysis of this. M. Kaye ------------------------------ End of FORKNI-L Digest - 8 Mar 2000 to 9 Mar 2000 (#2000-69) ************************************************************
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