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Logfile LOG9606A Part 11

June 5-June 6, 1996

File: "FORKNI-L LOG9606A" Part 11

	TOPICS:
	IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!  (10)
	Father and son
	FK Mini-con at TorontoTrek  (2)
	It can happen  (3)
	Poacher?  What poacher?
	Nick and Nat in StF
	Jon Cassar and directing
	Okay ... SOS-FK
	Repost: Calling All CERK Fans
	Virtual season (no spoilers)  (2)
	Nat and StF
	John K.
	FK Taping Offer
	Bridging the Knight
	German episodes; SOS-FK

=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 6 Jun 1996 02:23:27 GMT
From:         Jamie Melody Randell <immajer@n.......>
Subject:      Re: IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!

On Jun 05, 1996 18:51:55, '"Lisa P." <LadysAVamp@a.......>' wrote:


>The first time I went to a convention (Beauty and the Beast) was because I

>saw an ad in the TV Guide.  There are mini-cons coming up soon.  The TV Guide
>is a national (international?) media source.

Girl's got a point.

It's easy to forget that outside the Internet, and outside fandom, most of
"mainstream society" does not know that Forever Knight Fandom exists; that,
in fact, any fandom exists.  They know about "Trekkies", which are
portrayed as weirdos with pointy-ear prosthetics.  But they don't know that
there are actually thousands of 'normal' people who get together and
celebrate tv shows the way 'mainstream society' celebrates sporting events.


The first convention I ever went to was a fan-run job that I only even
heard about because they ran an advertisement on tv during the nightly Star
Trek rerun.  I basically would not be here right now, would neither be on
the internet nor involved in fandom, if it had not been for that television
commercial.  (A'course, I ended up running into an old friend at one of the
slash tables, and we spent the next five years following a rock band around
the country, but that's another story.  Eight years after that con, I did
find my way 'home'; and I never would have known that 'home' existed, had
it not been for that thirty-second spot.)

I would like to suggest that we give some consideration to a thorough
reorganization of the SOSFK campaign...  We still have the PO box, no?  Our
infrastructure is still in place -- we are in an ideal position to
communicate information about the show, to the audience out there that is
ONLY NOW learning that the show has been canceled, and to the viewers who
will discover FK for the first time on SciFi.  "Saving the show" is no
longer an issue; but we still need to make sure people know about the
books, the possibility of merchandise, any conventions that might occur,
the fan clubs out there...  First and foremost, we have to MAKE PEOPLE
AWARE that there is a community of people who also like this show.  When
people feel a sense of involvement within a community, they feel an
increased commitment toward the goal of that group -- namely, to bring
about MORE FK.

The more people we can 'bring across' into the community, the more people
there are to write letters and buy merchandise and hound their cable
companies for FK... and the more of us there are to spend money on the
product, the more likely Sony et al. are to listen to us.

I'd like to see a discussion on the viability of producing a short
all-purpose promo spot for the "Friends of Forever Knight", outlining our
basic goals and giving a couple of contact points -- the PO box, the web
page and maybe a phone number -- and the possibility of airing such a spot
on local cable stations, where advertising might be just-barely-affordable.
 It might be a total pipe dream, but advertising of any kind is still one
of the most effective ways to get the word out OUTSIDE the Internet &
fandom communities.  We have allies out there that we're unaware of; we
need to find them, and help them find us.

Thoughts?

--
 -:-:-:-:- Jamie M.R. <immajer@n.......> -:-:-:-:-
 Asst. Listowner, The Smoking Natpacker, ConvCoS, NDNEDnik
-->>> Illustrated Webgoddess & Keeper of Warm Fuzzies <<<--
** List Rules <http://cac.psu.edu/~jap8/FK/FKRules.html> **
The Truth Is Out There. Just maybe not in our jurisdiction.
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 22:23:50 -0400
From:         Angie <alasher@e.......>
Subject:      Re: IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!

At 05:19 PM 6/5/96 -0400, Mary Davis wrote:
>Check out the web page to save Space Above And Beyond.  They have made a
>great running start at what we need to do for Forever Knight.
<snip>
>They list lots of advertiser addresses and more...  Please check it out and
>take an action to save the knight.

Great idea. I have the space on my server to put up a page dealing with
sponsors, if it will
help the effort. I am also willing to write write write everyone!

~~~~~~~~~~~Lasher~~~~~~~~~~~
~Bunny~Unnamed Faction~ MOO~
~~~~~~Cousins of the Knight~~~~~~
^^http://home.earthlink.net/~alasher^^
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 22:32:49 +0000
From:         Karen Tobin <ktobin@t.......>
Subject:      Re: IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!

On  5 Jun 96 at 22:23, Angie wrote:


> Great idea. I have the space on my server to put up a page dealing with
> sponsors, if it will
> help the effort. I am also willing to write write write everyone!


I already have this!

http://www.tiac.net/users/ktobin/sosfk.html


Karen, Knightie/Heartbreaker (ktobin@t.......,
 http://www.tiac.net/users/ktobin/fk.html)
Reference Librarian, Save Forever Knight Campaign/Almighty Address Goddess
Forever Knight has been cancelled. To help, email me
and/or visit: http://members.aol.com/CuznJamiMR/SaveForeverKnight.html
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 22:49:18 +0500
From:         John Folden <jtfolden@e.......>
Subject:      Re: IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!

> From: "Jamie Melody Randell" <immajer@n.......>

>  It might be a total pipe dream, but advertising of any kind is still one
> of the most effective ways to get the word out OUTSIDE the Internet &
> fandom communities.  We have allies out there that we're unaware of; we
> need to find them, and help them find us.

What about newspaper ads in major areas? Perhaps we could put together
a listing of areas where FK was strong in the ratings and use that
as a starting point....This would work for TV spots, as well.


//----------------------------------------
// John T. Folden, a demented victorian
// lost in the DARK SHADOWS of an endless
// FOREVER KNIGHT...
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 23:07:10 -0400
From:         dotti rhodes <dottir@w.......>
Subject:      Re: Father and son

At 03:21 PM 6/5/96 -0400, you wrote:

>
>This is one of the scenes that really hooked me on FK.  There was just
something about the look on Nick's face after LaCroix belts him ... like he
wasn't the slightest bit surprised -- but not defiant, either.
>
Having been rewatching all of FK lately (what a chore) coz I've been duping,
I realized that LaCroix beats the hell out of Nick quite often....he was
probably used to it by then so I agree with your abused child thoughts..
Dotti R
Knightie 4-Ever
dottir@w.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 23:07:13 -0400
From:         dotti rhodes <dottir@w.......>
Subject:      Re: FK Mini-con at TorontoTrek

At 04:09 PM 6/5/96 -0500, Stephanie wrote:
>
>In y'all's experience, what kind of prices do things like this bring at
>these charity auctions? IOW, does an individual have a chance at all at
>getting some of this stuff, or do folks have to pool their resources just
>to have a shot?
>
In my experience, Stephanie, the only people who have a shot at those types
of things are those who have a credit card limit of about $1500.00 or have
been saving for a while. I've been going to conventions for 20 years and
have yet to be able to buy anything at an auction.  They always go to those
who have lots of money.  The rest of us normal people just sit and drool at
them.

Dotti R
Knightie 4-Ever
dottir@w.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 22:56:08 +0500
From:         John Folden <jtfolden@e.......>
Subject:      Re: It can happen

> From: "J.S. Levin/Stormsinger" <wabbit@e.......>
>
> John T. Folden, our demented Victorian, suggests:
> >FK in there...Perhaps we should organize some sort of
> >project where we pick a new company to "bug & inform" each month or
> >something....
>
> I think this is a *stupendous* idea!  Let's do it; it *sure* can't hurt.

Thanks! After thinking on this more...I think this might not be too
difficult under some circumstances...Some companies could no doubt
be reached thru the Internet, of course...while other may require snail
mail...  Last time I checked Entertainment Weekly had a web page at

http://www.timeinc.com/ew/

I'm sure there must be an E-Mail address there somewhere....
If nothing else maybe we could point them to the SOS-FK web page!
Perhaps we could hit Sci-Fi mags, as well?  I don't normally
read those myself but I know a lot of people do...and surely some
of them can be contacted on the Net...

> Noted, btw, that the K:tE site set up in late March by Spelling or Fox or
> whoever has had 2.6 *MILLION* hits to date.  C'mon, folks -- surely we're

Whoa!  You must be joking????? I thought the show was 'OK' (but not FK
by a long shot) but 2.6 million????

//----------------------------------------
// John T. Folden, a demented victorian
// lost in the DARK SHADOWS of an endless
// FOREVER KNIGHT...
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 20:07:13 -0700
From:         Angie <alasher@e.......>
Subject:      Re: IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!

At 10:32 PM 6/5/96 +0000, Karen Tobin wrote:
>I already have this!
>http://www.tiac.net/users/ktobin/sosfk.html

I just checked it out Karen. Great site, and I am glad its there!


~~~~~~~~~~~Lasher~~~~~~~~~~~
~Bunny~Unnamed Faction~ MOO~
~~~~~~Cousins of the Knight~~~~~~
^^http://home.earthlink.net/~alasher^^
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 22:15:21 -0500
From:         TippiNB <Tippinb@i.......>
Subject:      Poacher?  What poacher?

I'm notorious for deleting mail before I'm actually through with it...

Someone (several someones, I think) was discussing Nick's "code" of only
killing the guilty and mentioned his killing a poacher.  Which episode was
this?  I'm slowly but surely getting through the 1st and 2nd season episodes
(I haven't seen the 2nd season since it actually aired the first time).

In The Hunted, the flashback shows Nick hunting - and enjoying it - an older
man, chasing him through the woods, being rather gleeful when LaCroix
suggests they hunt for their meal that night.  By their costumes, this is
the 1800's (pause while I refer to the timeline....), okay 1850s.

Is this old guy the poacher?  I didn't see any evidence of him being a
poacher.  Sure, he has a bow and arrow, but no dead animals strewn about
anywhere.  And if he was a poacher, wouldn't he have been a little less
accommodating to three people who looked like nobility?  He offers them a
seat at his fire.  If I'd been guilty of poaching and I saw three high-class
people who looked like landowners, I woulda gotten the hell out of Dodge.

Unless we're talking about some other episode entirely...

I'm one confused Cousin.  So what else is new?

Wicked Cousin Tippi, Dollar Bill Wrangler of the Thong Throng!
*Voyeur of the Menage LaCroix*Founding Member: Unnamed Faction*
"What a Twinkie humanity is, rich in its complexity, soft in its cake-like
exterior.  Creamy of spirit, and most of all... delicious."
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 23:16:08 +0500
From:         John Folden <jtfolden@e.......>
Subject:      Re: IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!

> From: "Leslie I.Plummer" <lplummer@i.......>
>
> John Folden wrote:
> >Perhaps we should organize some sort of project where we pick a new
> >(media) company to "bug & inform" (them about FK) each month or
> >something....
>
> GREAT IDEA!  Wouldn't take too much.  We could choose a different
> "target" each month & keep doing it Till We Get Our FK!

I was wondering how long it would take you to jump on this Leslie! <wink>
I've received several positive responses to an idea that just popped into
my head right before I logged off yesterday...This is nice...I could get
used to this....hehehe



//----------------------------------------
// John T. Folden, a demented victorian
// lost in the DARK SHADOWS of an endless
// FOREVER KNIGHT...
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 20:24:31 -0700
From:         Cynthia Hoffman <choff@v.......>
Subject:      Re: FK Mini-con at TorontoTrek

On Wed, 5 Jun 1996, Stephanie Babbitt wrote:

> In y'all's experience, what kind of prices do things like this bring at
> these charity auctions? IOW, does an individual have a chance at all at
> getting some of this stuff, or do folks have to pool their resources just
> to have a shot?

I've been doing this kind of thing for a while, and sometimes you win,
sometimes you don't.

I've gone after stuff and gotten it for next to nothing, and I've gone
after stuff and spent hundreds of dollars...and I've watched as stuff I
covet goes to others because I simply can't go that high.

But the answer is, regular people can get the stuff.  It just depends on
how badly you want it.

Cynthia
Cynthia Hoffman/choff@v.......
Raven ** IB ** MBDtK
We cater to the occasional fetishist
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 23:23:36 +0500
From:         John Folden <jtfolden@e.......>
Subject:      Re: IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!

> From: "Angie" <alasher@e.......>

> >GREAT IDEA!  Wouldn't take too much.  We could choose a different

> 1. TV Guide. This one is self explainitory and they could give us a write up

Yep, that's a good one...I'm dreaming now.
I can just see the front cover of the August issue:
A great pic of Nick, vamped out, with the caption "The Fans That Wouldn't Die".

hehehehe...I've truly lost it....


//----------------------------------------
// John T. Folden, a demented victorian
// lost in the DARK SHADOWS of an endless
// FOREVER KNIGHT...
=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 6 Jun 1996 03:34:53 GMT
From:         Jamie Melody Randell <immajer@n.......>
Subject:      Re: It can happen

On Jun 05, 1996 11:38:31, '"J.S. Levin/Stormsinger" <wabbit@e.......>'
wrote:


>Noted, btw, that the K:tE site set up in late March by Spelling or Fox or
>whoever has had 2.6 *MILLION* hits to date.  C'mon, folks -- surely we're
>*at least* that rabid!  Whose email can we flood, whose counter can we
>overload????

Um, you do realize that it is a relatively easy thing to 'gimmick' a
counter, or simply to specify a ludicrously high number instead of 'zero'
as a starting value?

In order to have received that many hits, someone would have had to have
loaded that page once every two seconds.  I don't think that even the
Netscape page gets hit that frequently.  (This can be authenticated via
Webcrawler.  They keep tabs on the most frequently hit pages.)

WE have had 44,000 hits on the SOSFK web page since December.  And WE did
not cheat. :-)


--
 -:-:-:-:- Jamie M.R. <immajer@n.......> -:-:-:-:-
 Asst. Listowner, The Smoking Natpacker, ConvCoS, NDNEDnik
-->>> Illustrated Webgoddess & Keeper of Warm Fuzzies <<<--
** List Rules <http://cac.psu.edu/~jap8/FK/FKRules.html> **
The Truth Is Out There. Just maybe not in our jurisdiction.
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 22:03:06 -0500
From:         Margie Hammet <treeleaf@i.......>
Subject:      Re: IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!

At 02:23 AM 6/6/96 GMT, Jamie Melody Randell wrote:

>advertising of any kind is still one of the most effective ways to get
>the word out OUTSIDE the Internet & fandom communities.

I think it's a great idea.  I think a lot of the time we get so used to
having computer access, that we forget that most people _don't_ have it.
About that P.O. box - Do people who write to it get info on what's going
on with the campaign?  How about a biweekly or monthly newsletter for people
who don't have computer access?  Besides updates on what the campaign is
doing, it could list available merchandise.  By the way, folks, bumper
stickers are great free advertising.  Isn't there one available with
the Forever Knight logo?  It might be a good idea to sell that through the
P.O. Box.  Make it real easy for people to get it.



Margie (treeleaf@i.......)
N&NPacker
Cousin of the Knight
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 23:34:00 +0500
From:         John Folden <jtfolden@e.......>
Subject:      Re: IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!

> > From: "Angie" <alasher@e.......>
>
> > >GREAT IDEA!  Wouldn't take too much.  We could choose a different
>
> > 1. TV Guide. This one is self explainitory and they could give us a write up
>
> Yep, that's a good one...I'm dreaming now.
> I can just see the front cover of the August issue:
> A great pic of Nick, vamped out, with the caption "The Fans That Wouldn't Die".
>
> hehehehe...I've truly lost it....

Oppps, thaought I'd add something to the bottom of my reply....

I just checked and There's an Official TV Guide Web page at:

http://www.iguide.com/tv/

They have a special page just for input/comments....Hmmmmm, wonder what we
could use that for?  Anyone have any ideas...   :)


//----------------------------------------
// John T. Folden, a demented victorian
// lost in the DARK SHADOWS of an endless
// FOREVER KNIGHT...
=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 6 Jun 1996 03:40:39 GMT
From:         Jamie Melody Randell <immajer@n.......>
Subject:      Re: IT WILL HAPPEN, if we Make it Happen!

On Jun 05, 1996 17:19:35, 'Mary Davis <Spirit3679@a.......>' wrote:


>Check out the web page to save Space Above And Beyond.  They have made a
>great running start at what we need to do for Forever Knight.


Oh, yeah...  I think I remember them.  I think that they were one of the
many groups that wrote me at CuznJamiMR, asking for pointers on how to run
an SOS web page.

(My stock reply being: Get yourself a mailing list of rabid fans, find
someone to write up an FAQ, then locate some poor sucker who doesn't mind
HTML-coding, and is easily placated by a grandiose title of some sort.)

--
Jamie M.R. <immajer@n.......>
Otherwise Known As The Webgoddess
<http://members.aol.com/CuznJamiMR/SaveForeverKnight.html>
The Truth Is Out There. Just maybe not in our jurisdiction.
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 23:54:57 -0400
From:         dotti rhodes <dottir@w.......>
Subject:      Re: Nick and Nat in StF

At 06:36 PM 6/5/96 -0700, you wrote:

>(Ahem!) Janette *accepts* him? I would very much disagree with this!
>Janette is the one who keeps telling him that what he wants isn't what he
>should want (i.e., to be human).

This is true, but it is not something she constantly harps at him, and she
is always there for him when he needs her.
>
Hmmm, I don't mean to do Natalie a disservice. What you say is true and I've
been here since season one too, and he did go to her after she offered to
try, and she does hang in there with him because she knows he does want to
be cured. But I can't help but think that he feels if he does decide he's
tired of trying, he might be content to continue as he is now, that she
would walk out on him at that point, that she would not be willing to stay
with him, that she would only be there as long as he wants to change.  I'm
not saying that would ever happen, he does truly want to be mortal again,
but he also often strikes me as being so very tired, at least this third
season, and if he had that nagging doubt in his mind that she would accept
him if he did decide to give it a rest, then someone like Emily who accepted
that part of him would definitely be attractive to him.

Ya think?? :)
Dotti R
Knightie 4-Ever
dottir@w.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 22:45:13 -0500
From:         Carrie Krumtum <carriek@e.......>
Subject:      Re: Jon Cassar and directing

Marcia Tucker wrote:
>He also said that he was with the show from the beginning, and he
>justified saying that because he was the *camera operator* for "Dark
>Knight"! So, we have seen a crew person essentially take up the
>director's chair, and quite adequately, I might say!

Thanks Marcia. I'd forgotten about that. I'm wondering if this is a
'normal' occurance in the biz. I know we're talking about Toronto and
NOT Hollywood, still, it seems like an unlikely sequence of events. One
doesn't just say to themselves, I think I'll be a nurse tomorrow, if
they have been working in the laundry. There are steps you must take. I
guess I always assumed (yeah, yeah, I know what they say about
assumptions) that it worked pretty much the same way in television. Of
course, I'm a nurse, and somewhat dense on these matters. <g>

I agree, Jon has directed some wonderful eps. C&C has the most powerful
imagery. The humor in Outside the Lines is wonderful. And AtA, well...
(no spoilers). I just thought it was unusual, that's all. Neat, but
unusual.

<happily bewildered by the whole industry and FK in particular>
--
Carrie, Proud Knightie
The Nurse is a hampster
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 20:48:40 -0700
From:         Cynthia Hoffman <choff@v.......>
Subject:      Okay ... SOS-FK

On Wed, 5 Jun 1996, Margie Hammet wrote:

> About that P.O. box - Do people who write to it get info on what's going
> on with the campaign?

Yep.  That's one of the things it's there for.  Lana Soward has been
keeping it for months now, and she handles everything and forwards stuff
to the appropriate person.  We're also using it as a central address for
all SOS activity because it's a professional sort of thing to do and we're
pros.

> How about a biweekly or monthly newsletter for people
> who don't have computer access?

Annmarie has been doing this since December.  She maintains a snail mail
list as well as an offlist email loop that keeps over 600 people up to
date on the SOS.

> Besides updates on what the campaign is
> doing, it could list available merchandise.

Listen up now.  This is really really important.

> the Forever Knight logo?  It might be a good idea to sell that through
> the P.O. Box.  Make it real easy for people to get it.

This is ILLEGAL!  We do not own the FK logo, Sony/TriStar owns that logo.
They own all the logos associated with the show.  Ronni Katz has licensed
a variation on the CERK logo, but otherwise, those logos are off limits.

SOS-FK has been incredibly careful about making sure not to tread on
copyright toes ... let's not blow it now.

Please people.  Let's not reinvent the wheel here.  Go check out the web
page ... find out what's being done already and then let's work from
there, okay?

BTW, I have press kits that just need some slight updating ... suggestions
for where to send them are greatly appreciated.

Cynthia
Cynthia Hoffman/choff@v.......
Raven ** IB ** MBDtK
We cater to the occasional fetishist
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 20:56:22 -0700
From:         Denise Underwood <ithildin@m.......>
Subject:      Re: Repost: Calling All CERK Fans

>  From: "Lisa P." <LadysAVamp@a.......>, on 6/5/96 7:26 PM:
>  I asked Ron the Enforcer if there was any chance of making a t-shirt (or
>  sweatshirt) similar to the bumper sticker?
>
Silly question  :)  But what bumper sticker, and what is on it?? I love buying
shirts, and I always need a new one !  heheheee.

Denise  ~The Cousinly Ravenette~  ~TEDT~  ~Killer Bunny of the Clan McGregor~
"That Rabbit has a viscous streak a mile wide!It's a killer!" Tim,Enchanter
                                       ithildin@m.......
        ** Ask me about Forever Knight chat every evening on IRC EFNet!! **
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 23:55:00 -0400
From:         Pat Witham <catspaw@m.......>
Subject:      Virtual season (no spoilers)

To those who are concerned about ill feelings if a virtual season happens,
would it help if the stories were posted on FKFIC anonymously?  Pat
Witham (catspaw@c.......)
Still loyal Knightie and member of CSS, Forever Knight who says Ni
**Faciemus ut Dewus Mountainus e Tuo Nasone Exeat!**
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 20:59:46 -0700
From:         Sharon Himmanen <romana@i.......>
Subject:      Nat and StF

Dotti wrote:
>This is true.  But listen to what Emily has to say about vampires when Nick
>asks her about them.  [snip] The only other person to accept him as he is
>is Janette, Natalie wants him human and doesn't really UNDERSTAND all that
>he goes thru in fighting his "addiction".

I liked StF for the fantasy sequences, but I have to admit that Nick's whole
infatuation with Emily just left me scratching my head.  I just didn't see
it because it happened so fast, but in some ways that's in character for
Nick.  He gets these bizarre, all-or-none infatuations and just falls head
over teacups into them without really stopping to think.

As for Natalie accepting him, I don't agree with you Dotti.  I think Natalie
*does* accept all the good and bad in Nick and it goes beyond just wanting
him to be human.  She just doesn't buy into the vampire as evil bit as much
as Nick does (less so as the series goes on but the best evidence of that is
still in spoiler protection)  She does want that for him because he wants it
for himself (or so he says).  In some ways I think Natalie understands him
*more* than a lot of other mortals.  Emily had a superficial understanding
of the vampiric condition, which is what Nick bought into.  But I think
Natalie is one of the few people Nick has really let *in* and probably the
first mortal who knows his secret that he's had a longstanding, close
relationship with.  And I think that's due in part to her initial reaction
to him.  She saw him at what Nick feels is his worst, all vamped out, and
her first instinct was to reach out and touch him, to understand *who* and
*what* he was.

>It must have felt like so good to hear someone understand him without the
>judgment behind it, without the pointed finger.  I can understand why he
>fell so hard so fast.

I don't think Natalie judges his past acts.  In fact she's always gone out
of her way to point out that what he wants to do now counts while never
denying his past.  *Nick* is the one who isn't honest with her, really.  Not
that I blame him--I'm sure he's done all sorts of horrible things that he
doesn't want to talk about.  Yeah, she gets on his case when he backslides,
but that's her job.  He says he wants to be human.  She's keeping him honest.

>As much as he loves Natalie (and I do believe he does) he felt she could
>never totally accept and understand the vampire in him, until ofcourse,
>"Francesca".  That's how I looked at it....my zwei pfennig.

Now here I agree with you.  "*He* felt she could never totally accept."
It's Nick who puts that contraint there, not really Natalie.  I think she
has a pretty good idea of and accepts the evil he's done--lets face it;
Nick is a serial killer.  He's the one who won't be himself around Natalie.
And I didn't see him running around telling Emily Weiss all his deep dark
secrets either.

Just my two cents...

Sharon

--
Sharon A. Himmanen * romana@i....... * romana@a.......
NatPack ** BotCoS ** Keeper of the GopherGame
Nat's B&B     http://members.aol.com/romana/natpage_stuff/natpack.htm
SOS-FK        http://members.aol.com/CuznJamiMR/SaveForeverKnight.html
"You can sleep anytime.  How often to you get to have a beer with me?"
--unattributed quote
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 21:05:08 -0700
From:         Antonia Spadafina <asginger@i.......>
Subject:      John K.

Hi all--
  I've seen GWD and NB in other venues, but has JK done anything
recently?

Toni
Knightie from NYC
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 21:08:48 -0700
From:         Antonia Spadafina <asginger@i.......>
Subject:      FK Taping Offer

Hi all--
  I offered to record some 3rd season eps (commercial-free) from the Sci-Fi
channel, but have had no response.

  Do I take this to mean that everyone has 3rd season or SF channel, and no
one needs the taping service?

EMAIL me private if you want to take advantage of an unexpected altruistic
flare-up.

Toni S
asginger@i....... / antonia_spadafina@s.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 6 Jun 1996 00:10:27 EDT
From:         Ian Curtis <102425.1537@c.......>
Subject:      Re: virtual season (no spoilers)

>>Can you set up a separate e-mail loop for the virtual season, sort
>>of like the DEBSPLAY thing?

        ...or better yet, get all of the people who are interested in a virtual
season to all pitch in and make a whole new list, FKVIRTSEAS or something like
that.  maybe not...wadda ya want? I'm a Malkie!

        -- Ian Curtis
        Malkavian Monitor of Toronto, Ronin leader
        "She's making little frogs..."
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jun 1996 21:55:46 -0700
From:         Wendy Marie Christensen <wendy@i.......>
Subject:      Re: Bridging the Knight

Call me stupid... but what is a wrap party???



-Wendy Marie-   \|/              Unnamed Faction*Cousin
               |o o|             "We *are* each other.  You will always
     -------ooO~(_)~Ooo------    be mine, eternally." LC to Nick
    wendy@i.......
=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 6 Jun 1996 00:49:40 -0400
From:         Allison Percy <percy91@w.......>
Subject:      German episodes; SOS-FK

D Echelbarger <gryphon@e.......> said:

> [1st season] Canadian cut is *definitely* worth the effort to acquire!

I agree here.  While much of the minutes cut were pointless
driving-around-Toronto-listening-to-music or hanging-out-at-the-loft-
goofing-off scenes, some episodes had important chunks chopped out of
them. :^(  But the problem is, most people who have them are plum tuckered
out from taping them for friends.

> Oh, there's also a 1st season German version, which apparently tried to
> mandate "one half-nude woman" per episode for a while... <eg>

Thanks to a German fan <hi, Dana!>, I acquired fuzzy copies of the first
season German episodes.  And while it *is* amusing to hear our favorite
characters speak German (and even French with a German accent in some of
the flashbacks), as far as I can tell there is no difference betweeen the
Canadian and the German cut of the first season.

Any extra nudity that was filmed (apparently they did film German versions
of some scenes, with topless women, for a few episodes right at the
beginning) was either cut out or carefully incorporated into the Canadian
version.  If you look at the Dark Knight flashbacks, you'll notice that
from some camera angles Nick's first meal (a beautiful woman) appears to
be wearing a high-necked dress, and then in the close-ups she seems to be
topless (although the camera carefully avoids going down too far).  I
presume that when they were doing the final edits on those first few
episodes they merged the German and Canadian versions.  But I have never
had a chance to ask anyone who might know for sure.

Of course it's all the same to me, since no one ever hinted that the
German versions had topless *men*, which might have caught my attention!
:^)


BTW, the fact that newbies on the list are *suggesting* that we *start* a
campaign to bring back Forever Knight is an indication of the sorry state
of the SOS-FK campaign right now.  Newbies may have no idea what
incredible feats of organization and dedication some people on this list
brought off.  The NATPE 7.  The ad in Electronic Media.  The presents to
syndie stations.  Flyers littering bookstores and conventions.  Nearly
$10,000 raised for charity (the vast majority of this within just a few
weeks) in honor of the cast and crew.  If nothing else, I suggest that we
up the allowance on .sig length if and only if the extra line is used to
include the "Bring Back FK" web page.  Just a thought.

IMO, the most important thing anyone can do right now is send letters to
the Sci-Fi Channel and/or USA.  Thank the SFC for showing FK during a
prime-time slot.  Send the SFC's Barry Schulman presents.  (No he's not a
relative of mine or anything like that, I just think he deserves presents
more than Kay Koplovitz and Jon Feltheimer did.) Write and call your local
cable company to get them to add the SFC, then tell the SFC that you are
doing this so that they'll know *Forever Knight* fans are trying to expand
their viewing audience.  Write to USA asking them to help fund future FK
made-for-TV movies.  All of these things can make a real difference.
Addresses can be found through the library of addresses linked to Jamie's
Save FK web page (URL in my .sig!).

Speaking of SOS-FK, a couple of months ago I wrote to NABISCO (Ritz Air
Crisps was a sponsor of FK) thanking them for supporting the show.  This
got me a nice $1 coupon and a letter back that said in part:

"We are glad to know that you appreciate our participation in sponsoring
the recent TV broadcast of 'Forever Knight'.  NABISCO takes great care in
producing high quality commercials and makes every effort to have our
advertisements aired during programs that the vast majority of consumers
find acceptable.  We certainly welcome viewer opinion and especially look
forward to sharing your thoughtful comments with our advertising
personnel."

At first I thought, great!  Then I thought, what do they mean they only
want their advertisements aired during programs that "the vast majority of
consumers find acceptable"?  Does this mean they get complaints all the
time about advertising during supposedly unacceptable shows?  Or does it
mean that they think FK is a show that the vast majority of consumers
would find acceptable?  <shrug>

In any case, the Air Crisps go very well with SPAM Lite (another FK
sponsor).  :^)

~~Allison ~~ percy91@w....... ~~ Knightie ~~ Chief Bunny ~~
~ SOS-FK: http://members.aol.com/CuznJamiMR/SaveForeverKnight.html ~
=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 6 Jun 1996 00:55:46 -0400
From:         Angie <alasher@e.......>
Subject:      Re: It can happen

At 10:56 PM 6/5/96 +0500, John Folden wrote:
>If nothing else maybe we could point them to the SOS-FK web page!
>Perhaps we could hit Sci-Fi mags, as well?  I don't normally
>read those myself but I know a lot of people do...and surely some
>of them can be contacted on the Net...

 I think we should also bombard the tv news magazines. *The Show That
Wouldn't Die*
(quite like the main characters!!!!!). I know its cheezy but shows like Hard
Copy and the like get a LOT of viewers! And thier sensationalism is watch by
exec's in the industry too, since they slop around a lot of dirt on other
people in the industry.


~~~~~~~~~~~Lasher~~~~~~~~~~~
~Bunny~Unnamed Faction~ MOO~
~~~~~~Cousins of the Knight~~~~~~
^^http://home.earthlink.net/~alasher^^
=========================================================================

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